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What data do you have that shows that painters are currently highly paid? It's entry-level construction work; AKA a shit job (maybe just a bit better than roofi

What data do you have that shows that painters are currently highly paid? It's entry-level construction work; AKA a shit job (maybe just a bit better than roofing), so I'm skeptical.

JumpCrisscross 3y ago
> It's entry-level construction work; AKA a shit job This was historically true for construction [1]. Yet their wages are on a smooth curve upwards [2]. The entire cohort of construction workers is currently seeing high real wages, and their data almost completely hide Covid. I’d also argue that commodity and skilled painting are different. The 50-year old commodity painter who honed his craft can charge a premium because he can smooth my drywall and put on a finish someone with zero training cannot. [1] https://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/the-public-cost-of-low-wage-jobs-in-the-us-construction-industry/ https://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/the-public-cost-of-low-wage... [2] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CES2000000003 https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CES2000000003
- hotpotamus 3y ago
  That paper that you're citing is from 2022; hardly what I'd call historic. And is 2 in real dollars? Because it doesn't look like it and I wonder if it would be just a flat line if it was. I'll say that I've worked along side my cousin's baby-daddy (I think in future I'll just call him "T" as that's less unwieldy), and he's a fine painter, but ultimately there just isn't that much to the job. I remember the first time I used a paint sprayer on a new construction job myself; basically you just need to learn where the trigger is and in a minute you can paint a wall that would take an hour with a roller.
  - JumpCrisscross 3y ago
    > paper that you're citing is from 2022 It’s looking at 2015 to 2019 data. I’m comparing that period to the post-2021 one. > is 2 in real dollars? No, nominal. They’re up in real terms, but I don’t have non-proprietary data for that.
    - hotpotamus 3y ago
      I'll just say that my on-the-ground experience (limited such as it is to the markets/trades that my friends and family work in) doesn't express that construction is all of a sudden a good job. I could perhaps be convinced that it has upgraded from a shit job to merely a crap one, perhaps because so many people have escaped it that they have to at least pay slightly better these days. If I had any kids, I'd still be inclined give them the same advice that my blue-collar parents gave me - go to school to do just about anything else.
      - JumpCrisscross 3y ago
        To be clear, I’m not saying it’s a good job. (Or a bad one.) I’m saying it’s better than it was before.

What data do you have that shows that painters are currently highly paid? It's entry-level construction work; AKA a shit job (maybe just a bit better than roofing), so I'm skeptical.

JumpCrisscross 3y ago

> It's entry-level construction work; AKA a shit job This was historically true for construction [1]. Yet their wages are on a smooth curve upwards [2]. The entire cohort of construction workers is currently seeing high real wages, and their data almost completely hide Covid. I’d also argue that commodity and skilled painting are different. The 50-year old commodity painter who honed his craft can charge a premium because he can smooth my drywall and put on a finish someone with zero training cannot. [1] https://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/the-public-cost-of-low-wage-jobs-in-the-us-construction-industry/ https://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/the-public-cost-of-low-wage... [2] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CES2000000003 https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CES2000000003

hotpotamus 3y ago
That paper that you're citing is from 2022; hardly what I'd call historic. And is 2 in real dollars? Because it doesn't look like it and I wonder if it would be just a flat line if it was. I'll say that I've worked along side my cousin's baby-daddy (I think in future I'll just call him "T" as that's less unwieldy), and he's a fine painter, but ultimately there just isn't that much to the job. I remember the first time I used a paint sprayer on a new construction job myself; basically you just need to learn where the trigger is and in a minute you can paint a wall that would take an hour with a roller.
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago
  > paper that you're citing is from 2022 It’s looking at 2015 to 2019 data. I’m comparing that period to the post-2021 one. > is 2 in real dollars? No, nominal. They’re up in real terms, but I don’t have non-proprietary data for that.
  - hotpotamus 3y ago
    I'll just say that my on-the-ground experience (limited such as it is to the markets/trades that my friends and family work in) doesn't express that construction is all of a sudden a good job. I could perhaps be convinced that it has upgraded from a shit job to merely a crap one, perhaps because so many people have escaped it that they have to at least pay slightly better these days. If I had any kids, I'd still be inclined give them the same advice that my blue-collar parents gave me - go to school to do just about anything else.
    - JumpCrisscross 3y ago
      To be clear, I’m not saying it’s a good job. (Or a bad one.) I’m saying it’s better than it was before.