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Their heros are places like Oracle, and now Uber. Orgs that get to just the right level of dependency where people and businesses just sigh and accept whatevers

Their heros are places like Oracle, and now Uber. Orgs that get to just the right level of dependency where people and businesses just sigh and accept whatevers necessary. Eventually, some country is going to realize a piece of software is essentially a utility and letting some private company keep a sector of the economy in it's grasp prevents progress and it'll be nationalized.

JKCalhoun 3y ago
So China. If you're right it will be interesting to watch. Interesting to see how other countries respond.
- cyanydeez 3y ago
  China comes from the wrong angle. everything in China already was nationalizes and they've been trying to give some , mostly fictious freedom. we're talking and socialism and European compromises. it's really weird you think we're talking about China.
  - JKCalhoun 3y ago
    I thought so because, as you say, Chinas has nationalized banks, the airline industry — because they view them as important components to the nation. I assumed we were not talking about the U.S. (and to a lesser degree European countries) since nationalization of the private industry is anathema to these countries. To be sure though I know nothing about nationalization sentiments in Europe these days.
    - cyanydeez 3y ago
      you are confused they didn't "nationalizes" banks they were never independent to begin with. you have a naive comparison and force it uncritically into this conversation.
robertlagrant 3y ago
Damn that private sector for inventing things that create progress. Let's pretend it's actually stopping progress when it creates progress.
- h2odragon 3y ago
  u seriously arguing oracle as a source of progress? "embrace, extinguish and extort" Oracle?
  - robertlagrant 3y ago
    > u seriously This is highly ironic. I was replying to your second paragraph. But on Oracle: I don't like Oracle very much, but you'd be wrong to think that the jump into relational databases on commodity hardware wasn't massively facilitated by Oracle. We aren't all renting mainframes in the cloud right now in a large part down to Oracle's advances in the last quarter of the 20th century. Oracle is still the world's third-largest tech company. That means what it does, even today, is extremely valuable.
    - phkahler 3y ago
      >> Oracle is still the world's third-largest tech company. That means what it does, even today, is extremely valuable. Not going to refute that, but what is that value really? Database software is readily available for free, so there's actually very little value in just the software right? Is it the stability of the product? Support? Just the big name behind it? Those are probably part of it.
      - robertlagrant 3y ago
        If you're creating a bank in 2024 from scratch, maybe you could now rely on OSS. But you'd probably rather still have a big name that has great expertise in what you want to do across all types of hardware who can come in and make sure things work. And that's from the perspective of not having the cost of changing. If you have to move off Oracle, which provides all these things, you'd have to spend a fortune and still be taking a higher risk.

JKCalhoun 3y ago

So China. If you're right it will be interesting to watch. Interesting to see how other countries respond.

cyanydeez 3y ago
China comes from the wrong angle. everything in China already was nationalizes and they've been trying to give some , mostly fictious freedom. we're talking and socialism and European compromises. it's really weird you think we're talking about China.
- JKCalhoun 3y ago
  I thought so because, as you say, Chinas has nationalized banks, the airline industry — because they view them as important components to the nation. I assumed we were not talking about the U.S. (and to a lesser degree European countries) since nationalization of the private industry is anathema to these countries. To be sure though I know nothing about nationalization sentiments in Europe these days.
  - cyanydeez 3y ago
    you are confused they didn't "nationalizes" banks they were never independent to begin with. you have a naive comparison and force it uncritically into this conversation.

robertlagrant 3y ago

Damn that private sector for inventing things that create progress. Let's pretend it's actually stopping progress when it creates progress.

h2odragon 3y ago
u seriously arguing oracle as a source of progress? "embrace, extinguish and extort" Oracle?
- robertlagrant 3y ago
  > u seriously This is highly ironic. I was replying to your second paragraph. But on Oracle: I don't like Oracle very much, but you'd be wrong to think that the jump into relational databases on commodity hardware wasn't massively facilitated by Oracle. We aren't all renting mainframes in the cloud right now in a large part down to Oracle's advances in the last quarter of the 20th century. Oracle is still the world's third-largest tech company. That means what it does, even today, is extremely valuable.
  - phkahler 3y ago
    >> Oracle is still the world's third-largest tech company. That means what it does, even today, is extremely valuable. Not going to refute that, but what is that value really? Database software is readily available for free, so there's actually very little value in just the software right? Is it the stability of the product? Support? Just the big name behind it? Those are probably part of it.
    - robertlagrant 3y ago
      If you're creating a bank in 2024 from scratch, maybe you could now rely on OSS. But you'd probably rather still have a big name that has great expertise in what you want to do across all types of hardware who can come in and make sure things work. And that's from the perspective of not having the cost of changing. If you have to move off Oracle, which provides all these things, you'd have to spend a fortune and still be taking a higher risk.