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I got trained in NASA soldering standards in the early 80s. Worked as a tech in college helping build test harnesses for an X-Ray telescope that was to fly on C

I got trained in NASA soldering standards in the early 80s. Worked as a tech in college helping build test harnesses for an X-Ray telescope that was to fly on Challenger. Got delayed after the accident, but I think it eventually flew 20 years later. They were very serious about this stuff, for obvious reasons. No rework possible in space. I still use those skills on my home DIY hobbies.

dylan604 3y ago
> No rework possible in space. I suddenly started imagining someone trying to strip some wire, twist the strands together, hold a soldering iron and the solder and the wires all while essentially having Mickey Mouse fingers from being in a space suit. If something ever deserved the No User Serviceable Parts Inside sticker...
- calamari4065 3y ago
  I really hope someone stuck a "no user serviceable parts" or "warranty void if removed" sticker on JWST
- rickydroll 3y ago
  That is why they made Wago lever nuts
  - dylan604 3y ago
    Being unfamiliar with this, I had to look it up[0]. While these look interesting, I can't imagine where I'd use them. They are HUGE. Like bigger than that even. I can't imagine unbolting the side panels of a satellite in space, being able to use one of these, and then it being able to fit back into the original position. [0] https://www.wago.com/us/discover-wire-and-splicing-connectors https://www.wago.com/us/discover-wire-and-splicing-connector...
    - verisimilitude 3y ago
      They're _excellent_ for wiring devices into junction boxes in construction; particularly when connecting the higher gauge luminaire wires of an overhead light to romex. For some reason they're polarizing among electricians in the US (they carry all necessary listings for use in the US...). By contrast, they're widely accepted and used elsewhere.
      - quickthrowman 3y ago
        > For some reason they're polarizing among electricians in the US They’re 8x more expensive and take longer to install than a wire nut, and they take up more space inside the device box. They’re also difficult to unterminate without damaging the lever nut or conductor. It’s not hard to splice #14 solid to #18 stranded with a wire nut, you just extend the smaller wire a bit beyond the end of the larger wire and twist. I’d recommend wago lever nuts to homeowners doing their own electrical work because homeowners are terrible at electrical work and the less chances for electrical fires, the better. I’m a commercial electrical project manager in the US.
      - dylan604 3y ago
        > they're polarizing among electricians in the US sounds like it needs a ground! /s but seriously, what kind of junction boxes are used outside the US that these would fit? as far as connecting a larger device wire to a smaller mains line seems odd to me. granted, i'm not an electrician, but it is pretty much opposite of all of my experiences with wiring commercial lighting and home lighting
    - mikeyouse 3y ago
      I use them almost exclusively in my home wiring - they're so much more user friendly compared to wire nuts. They are not large at all - I find wiring that these take a lot less space in tight boxes than a wire nut since they're flat and you can push them to the back more easily: https://imgur.com/a/tGTUJd9 https://imgur.com/a/tGTUJd9 They make stab Wagos as well which I don't recommend, but the lever ones are great. You can work 'hot' if you need to replace a switch or anything (don't work hot blah blah blah). Much of my existing wiring is crappy 50s era copper and in some areas, aluminum -- so to add GFCIs where useful, I use either the levers to join copper of shitty provenance or the ALCU junction connectors and a bit of the paste.
wrs 3y ago
This 1958 NASA soldering training video still holds up pretty well (aside from the sociological aspects!). https://youtu.be/_RXugDd0xik?si=Z9ToN_tMz0m6lHu3 https://youtu.be/_RXugDd0xik?si=Z9ToN_tMz0m6lHu3
- BuildTheRobots 3y ago
  At approximately 3:20 it explains that solder is a mix of tin and lead and through some quirk no-one understands, this causes it to melt at least 100c lower than either of those two elements on their own. We don't understand how, but we understand how to exploit that. Do we now understand why that happens? (edit: minor side-rant about high definition 16mm films being preserved at 480p mpeg.)
bumby 3y ago
>They were very serious about this stuff, for obvious reasons. No rework possible in space. There are other reasons that may be less apparent, like the fact that materials can have weird properties in space. One example is solder "whiskering"[1]. I believe NASA requires techs to be certified to the IPC-JSTD [2]. [1] https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/ https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/ [2] https://www.ipc.org/ipc-certifications https://www.ipc.org/ipc-certifications
- Clamchop 3y ago
  Note that tin whiskers happen in air here on Earth, too. Not a thing that only happens under vacuum.
- instagib 3y ago
  Whisker growth rates from 0.03 to 9 mm/yr have been reported. There are some elimination methods such as conformal coatings (very hazardous) and plating finishes (nickel/gold/palladium) that have been tested. I got certified by the IPC-J-STD-001H also soldering 201 surface mount components 0.6x0.3x0.25mm 0.05W handling.

dylan604 3y ago

> No rework possible in space. I suddenly started imagining someone trying to strip some wire, twist the strands together, hold a soldering iron and the solder and the wires all while essentially having Mickey Mouse fingers from being in a space suit. If something ever deserved the No User Serviceable Parts Inside sticker...

calamari4065 3y ago
I really hope someone stuck a "no user serviceable parts" or "warranty void if removed" sticker on JWST
rickydroll 3y ago
That is why they made Wago lever nuts
- dylan604 3y ago
  Being unfamiliar with this, I had to look it up[0]. While these look interesting, I can't imagine where I'd use them. They are HUGE. Like bigger than that even. I can't imagine unbolting the side panels of a satellite in space, being able to use one of these, and then it being able to fit back into the original position. [0] https://www.wago.com/us/discover-wire-and-splicing-connectors https://www.wago.com/us/discover-wire-and-splicing-connector...
  - verisimilitude 3y ago
    They're _excellent_ for wiring devices into junction boxes in construction; particularly when connecting the higher gauge luminaire wires of an overhead light to romex. For some reason they're polarizing among electricians in the US (they carry all necessary listings for use in the US...). By contrast, they're widely accepted and used elsewhere.
    - quickthrowman 3y ago
      > For some reason they're polarizing among electricians in the US They’re 8x more expensive and take longer to install than a wire nut, and they take up more space inside the device box. They’re also difficult to unterminate without damaging the lever nut or conductor. It’s not hard to splice #14 solid to #18 stranded with a wire nut, you just extend the smaller wire a bit beyond the end of the larger wire and twist. I’d recommend wago lever nuts to homeowners doing their own electrical work because homeowners are terrible at electrical work and the less chances for electrical fires, the better. I’m a commercial electrical project manager in the US.
    - dylan604 3y ago
      > they're polarizing among electricians in the US sounds like it needs a ground! /s but seriously, what kind of junction boxes are used outside the US that these would fit? as far as connecting a larger device wire to a smaller mains line seems odd to me. granted, i'm not an electrician, but it is pretty much opposite of all of my experiences with wiring commercial lighting and home lighting
  - mikeyouse 3y ago
    I use them almost exclusively in my home wiring - they're so much more user friendly compared to wire nuts. They are not large at all - I find wiring that these take a lot less space in tight boxes than a wire nut since they're flat and you can push them to the back more easily: https://imgur.com/a/tGTUJd9 https://imgur.com/a/tGTUJd9 They make stab Wagos as well which I don't recommend, but the lever ones are great. You can work 'hot' if you need to replace a switch or anything (don't work hot blah blah blah). Much of my existing wiring is crappy 50s era copper and in some areas, aluminum -- so to add GFCIs where useful, I use either the levers to join copper of shitty provenance or the ALCU junction connectors and a bit of the paste.

wrs 3y ago

This 1958 NASA soldering training video still holds up pretty well (aside from the sociological aspects!). https://youtu.be/_RXugDd0xik?si=Z9ToN_tMz0m6lHu3 https://youtu.be/_RXugDd0xik?si=Z9ToN_tMz0m6lHu3

BuildTheRobots 3y ago
At approximately 3:20 it explains that solder is a mix of tin and lead and through some quirk no-one understands, this causes it to melt at least 100c lower than either of those two elements on their own. We don't understand how, but we understand how to exploit that. Do we now understand why that happens? (edit: minor side-rant about high definition 16mm films being preserved at 480p mpeg.)

bumby 3y ago

>They were very serious about this stuff, for obvious reasons. No rework possible in space. There are other reasons that may be less apparent, like the fact that materials can have weird properties in space. One example is solder "whiskering"[1]. I believe NASA requires techs to be certified to the IPC-JSTD [2]. [1] https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/ https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/ [2] https://www.ipc.org/ipc-certifications https://www.ipc.org/ipc-certifications

Clamchop 3y ago
Note that tin whiskers happen in air here on Earth, too. Not a thing that only happens under vacuum.
instagib 3y ago
Whisker growth rates from 0.03 to 9 mm/yr have been reported. There are some elimination methods such as conformal coatings (very hazardous) and plating finishes (nickel/gold/palladium) that have been tested. I got certified by the IPC-J-STD-001H also soldering 201 surface mount components 0.6x0.3x0.25mm 0.05W handling.