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What if you just are tired of this empty propaganda? The people peddling this message have been systematically WRONG about everything for the past generation.

What if you just are tired of this empty propaganda? The people peddling this message have been systematically WRONG about everything for the past generation. Who has China invaded? Beyond the occasional regional border disputes, like in Vietnam, I'm hard-pressed to find any.

ApolloFortyNine 3y ago
They regularly threaten Taiwan. [1] The only reason they haven't acted is the US has said outright they'd intervene. This is the second comment like this in this thread, is it propaganda or naivety? It's hard to tell. [1] https://apnews.com/article/china-taiwan-elections-military-threats-ea68fa11a0b172c31162c0ff128cabf7#:~:text=China%20reaffirms%20its%20military%20threats%20against%20Taiwan%20weeks%20before%20the%20island's%20presidential%20election,-1%20of%205&text=TAIPEI%2C%20Taiwan%20(AP)%20%E2%80%94,claims%20as%20its%20own%20territory https://apnews.com/article/china-taiwan-elections-military-t....
- captaincaveman 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - biotopia 3y ago
    Taiwan has its own MILITARY FORCE, government, rule of law, economy, alliances for 70 years now. It is de facto an independent country. Unless someone brings that tired argument of Taiwan claims China as its own - no, China threatened to invade if Taiwan relinquishes that claim. And no, just because China forces other countries to not recognize Taiwan as a country, doesn't make it so. (if anything, most countries are now starting to freely associate with Taiwan, now that China is in decline)
    - captaincaveman 3y ago
      Yes they do, and like I said, think they should be left to get on with things on their own. However they are a break away geopolitical state that was only enabled to do so, by support from US to protect them, if the US hadn't enabled them the CCP would of invaded many many decades ago. You can brush this inconvenient fact under the carpet, but it's not a simple and clear cut as you make out. Both sides taking the extreme stance is why it can't be solved.
      - biotopia 3y ago
        Taiwan WAS a break away state 70 years ago that is an independent country FOR THE LAST 70 years. doesn't matter which ally (US, Japan, whoever) Taiwan had, it is operating as an independent country. If China attacks Taiwan, they are attacking another country. Just like Russia attacking Ukraine. Doesn't matter what psychobabble a dictator spouts.
        captaincaveman 3y ago
        Well if US stops protecting Taiwan, and China invades, that will end that debate. The new debate will be, Taiwan WAS an independent state and now isn't, and some one will come along and "yeah well that was 70 years ago!". Psychobabble or not, it boils down to how much anyone wants to get involved in a nasty fight to save someone else, which might end up causing more damage to Taiwan even if they do. I don't think this is right but is the world has always operated, not sure anything has changed.
  - jncfhnb 3y ago
    Framing it as an internal conflict is the CPP’s framing. Don’t legitimize it.
    - ok123456 3y ago
      How is it the "CPP"'s framing when both sides still claim it as their official position? From a day-to-day perspective, they treat each other as separate countries in practice, if not in name.
      - jncfhnb 3y ago
        That is not the position of Taiwan, and certainly not of the political party that just won the presidential election.
        pests 3y ago
        Taiwan still claims they are part of China. It is part of the public farce everyone is playing. To claim otherwise would throw an egg in face of China.
        jncfhnb 3y ago
        Surely you can provide evidence of this claim as the Taiwan state position?
        pests 3y ago
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_China#:~:text=The%20Kuomintang%20holds%20the%20%22One,both%20mainland%20China%20and%20Taiwan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_China#:~:text=The%20Kuomin....
        jncfhnb 3y ago
        You’ve just cited a link for a CCP backed political party which just lost the election by a sizeable amount.
  - seryoiupfurds 3y ago
    It's very convenient that whenever a dictator wants to invade and conquer a neighboring country, all they have to do is declare that it historically belonged to them and suddenly the "anti-imperialists" have no problem with it. It's the exact same rhetorical playbook Putin used with Ukraine.
    - rightbyte 3y ago
      I believe the problem "anti-imperialists" believe they are facing is that if they don't relativize Russian and potential Chinese wars, they feel that people get worked up into a war frency. They believe we need a reminder that our elite are not much better and that the alleged ethnical cleansing of Gaza is such a timely reminder. As a way to not get us dragged into yet more wars. I guess.
euroderf 3y ago
> Who has China invaded? Well, not whom but rather what large body of water.
- mrguyorama 3y ago
  There's also some completely innocent Australian divers that were maliciously injured for no reason, in flagrant violation of any acceptable inter-country interactions.
biotopia 3y ago
China is a military and economic supporter of Russia. Shipments of military-capable hardware expose a China-sized loophole in Western sanctions. https://www.politico.eu/article/china-firms-russia-body-armor-bullet-proof-drones-thermal-optics-army-equipment-shanghai-h-win/ https://www.politico.eu/article/china-firms-russia-body-armo.... China defies sanctions to make Russia its biggest oil supplier in 2023 https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/china-defies-sanctions-make-russia-its-biggest-oil-supplier-2023-2024-01-20/ https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/china-defies-sanctio... China is the biggest importer of Iran's oil. Iran's oil exports reach 5-year high, with China as top buyer https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Markets/Commodities/Iran-s-oil-exports-reach-5-year-high-with-China-as-top-buyer https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Markets/Commodities/Iran-s-.... Iran supports Houthi, and both with Iranian drones and Houthi missiles, are attacking US and European ships.
- ok123456 3y ago
  [flagged]
- mahkeiro 3y ago
  If no Western technology was found in Russian weapon that would be a valid point. But this is not the case as demonstrated by multiple news outlet. If China was not importing Iran’s oil the current oil price would be at least the double of what it is now, creating a lot of problem in Western countries. That’s why this will not change for the time being as this is a loose loose game.
karaterobot 3y ago
Who said anything about invasions? You could at least respond to the actual allegations made by the person you're responding to. There are perfectly good responses you could make to them rather than changing the subject.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
yumraj 3y ago
> Who has China invaded? This has got to be a joke… Tibet in 1951 India in 1962 China-Vietnam war 1979 Currently, China has border dispute with every country it shares the border with, except two: North Korea and Pakistan It is illegally building outposts in S. China Sea encroaching on every other country’s marine zone. It is constantly threatening Taiwan It is building Navy at a massive pace, attacking every country using its hacker force It is a singular biggest threat to world peace at this time.
- samhw 3y ago
  It also continues to farm human beings. Tens of thousands of human beings each year are murdered to order (or, more accurately, they have their organs cut out and then are left to die) for Western transplant tourists who will pay upwards of $100k for the prime cuts. They and their medical systems and governments know full well that a heart transplant scheduled on a particular date three months in advance admits of no pleasant explanations. But nobody cares. China Tribunal judgement (2020): https://chinatribunal.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/ChinaTribunal_JUDGMENT_1stMarch_2020.pdf https://chinatribunal.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/ChinaTr... 2022 update from Ethan Gutmann (who wrote one of the major early reports): https://chrissmith.house.gov/uploadedfiles/gutmann_-_witness_testimony_template.pdf https://chrissmith.house.gov/uploadedfiles/gutmann_-_witness...
  - whythre 3y ago
    I feel like I’m the coming years the organ harvesting business will only grow and spread as the population ages and the need for replacements grows.

ApolloFortyNine 3y ago

They regularly threaten Taiwan. [1] The only reason they haven't acted is the US has said outright they'd intervene. This is the second comment like this in this thread, is it propaganda or naivety? It's hard to tell. [1] https://apnews.com/article/china-taiwan-elections-military-threats-ea68fa11a0b172c31162c0ff128cabf7#:~:text=China%20reaffirms%20its%20military%20threats%20against%20Taiwan%20weeks%20before%20the%20island's%20presidential%20election,-1%20of%205&text=TAIPEI%2C%20Taiwan%20(AP)%20%E2%80%94,claims%20as%20its%20own%20territory https://apnews.com/article/china-taiwan-elections-military-t....

captaincaveman 3y ago
[flagged]
- biotopia 3y ago
  Taiwan has its own MILITARY FORCE, government, rule of law, economy, alliances for 70 years now. It is de facto an independent country. Unless someone brings that tired argument of Taiwan claims China as its own - no, China threatened to invade if Taiwan relinquishes that claim. And no, just because China forces other countries to not recognize Taiwan as a country, doesn't make it so. (if anything, most countries are now starting to freely associate with Taiwan, now that China is in decline)
  - captaincaveman 3y ago
    Yes they do, and like I said, think they should be left to get on with things on their own. However they are a break away geopolitical state that was only enabled to do so, by support from US to protect them, if the US hadn't enabled them the CCP would of invaded many many decades ago. You can brush this inconvenient fact under the carpet, but it's not a simple and clear cut as you make out. Both sides taking the extreme stance is why it can't be solved.
    - biotopia 3y ago
      Taiwan WAS a break away state 70 years ago that is an independent country FOR THE LAST 70 years. doesn't matter which ally (US, Japan, whoever) Taiwan had, it is operating as an independent country. If China attacks Taiwan, they are attacking another country. Just like Russia attacking Ukraine. Doesn't matter what psychobabble a dictator spouts.
      - captaincaveman 3y ago
        Well if US stops protecting Taiwan, and China invades, that will end that debate. The new debate will be, Taiwan WAS an independent state and now isn't, and some one will come along and "yeah well that was 70 years ago!". Psychobabble or not, it boils down to how much anyone wants to get involved in a nasty fight to save someone else, which might end up causing more damage to Taiwan even if they do. I don't think this is right but is the world has always operated, not sure anything has changed.
- jncfhnb 3y ago
  Framing it as an internal conflict is the CPP’s framing. Don’t legitimize it.
  - ok123456 3y ago
    How is it the "CPP"'s framing when both sides still claim it as their official position? From a day-to-day perspective, they treat each other as separate countries in practice, if not in name.
    - jncfhnb 3y ago
      That is not the position of Taiwan, and certainly not of the political party that just won the presidential election.
      - pests 3y ago
        Taiwan still claims they are part of China. It is part of the public farce everyone is playing. To claim otherwise would throw an egg in face of China.
        jncfhnb 3y ago
        Surely you can provide evidence of this claim as the Taiwan state position?
        pests 3y ago
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_China#:~:text=The%20Kuomintang%20holds%20the%20%22One,both%20mainland%20China%20and%20Taiwan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_China#:~:text=The%20Kuomin....
        jncfhnb 3y ago
        You’ve just cited a link for a CCP backed political party which just lost the election by a sizeable amount.
- seryoiupfurds 3y ago
  It's very convenient that whenever a dictator wants to invade and conquer a neighboring country, all they have to do is declare that it historically belonged to them and suddenly the "anti-imperialists" have no problem with it. It's the exact same rhetorical playbook Putin used with Ukraine.
  - rightbyte 3y ago
    I believe the problem "anti-imperialists" believe they are facing is that if they don't relativize Russian and potential Chinese wars, they feel that people get worked up into a war frency. They believe we need a reminder that our elite are not much better and that the alleged ethnical cleansing of Gaza is such a timely reminder. As a way to not get us dragged into yet more wars. I guess.

euroderf 3y ago

> Who has China invaded? Well, not whom but rather what large body of water.

mrguyorama 3y ago
There's also some completely innocent Australian divers that were maliciously injured for no reason, in flagrant violation of any acceptable inter-country interactions.

biotopia 3y ago

China is a military and economic supporter of Russia. Shipments of military-capable hardware expose a China-sized loophole in Western sanctions. https://www.politico.eu/article/china-firms-russia-body-armor-bullet-proof-drones-thermal-optics-army-equipment-shanghai-h-win/ https://www.politico.eu/article/china-firms-russia-body-armo.... China defies sanctions to make Russia its biggest oil supplier in 2023 https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/china-defies-sanctions-make-russia-its-biggest-oil-supplier-2023-2024-01-20/ https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/china-defies-sanctio... China is the biggest importer of Iran's oil. Iran's oil exports reach 5-year high, with China as top buyer https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Markets/Commodities/Iran-s-oil-exports-reach-5-year-high-with-China-as-top-buyer https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Markets/Commodities/Iran-s-.... Iran supports Houthi, and both with Iranian drones and Houthi missiles, are attacking US and European ships.

ok123456 3y ago
[flagged]
mahkeiro 3y ago
If no Western technology was found in Russian weapon that would be a valid point. But this is not the case as demonstrated by multiple news outlet. If China was not importing Iran’s oil the current oil price would be at least the double of what it is now, creating a lot of problem in Western countries. That’s why this will not change for the time being as this is a loose loose game.

karaterobot 3y ago

Who said anything about invasions? You could at least respond to the actual allegations made by the person you're responding to. There are perfectly good responses you could make to them rather than changing the subject.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

yumraj 3y ago

> Who has China invaded? This has got to be a joke… Tibet in 1951 India in 1962 China-Vietnam war 1979 Currently, China has border dispute with every country it shares the border with, except two: North Korea and Pakistan It is illegally building outposts in S. China Sea encroaching on every other country’s marine zone. It is constantly threatening Taiwan It is building Navy at a massive pace, attacking every country using its hacker force It is a singular biggest threat to world peace at this time.

samhw 3y ago
It also continues to farm human beings. Tens of thousands of human beings each year are murdered to order (or, more accurately, they have their organs cut out and then are left to die) for Western transplant tourists who will pay upwards of $100k for the prime cuts. They and their medical systems and governments know full well that a heart transplant scheduled on a particular date three months in advance admits of no pleasant explanations. But nobody cares. China Tribunal judgement (2020): https://chinatribunal.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/ChinaTribunal_JUDGMENT_1stMarch_2020.pdf https://chinatribunal.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/ChinaTr... 2022 update from Ethan Gutmann (who wrote one of the major early reports): https://chrissmith.house.gov/uploadedfiles/gutmann_-_witness_testimony_template.pdf https://chrissmith.house.gov/uploadedfiles/gutmann_-_witness...
- whythre 3y ago
  I feel like I’m the coming years the organ harvesting business will only grow and spread as the population ages and the need for replacements grows.