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I never said that we're uncompetitive solely because of environmental and labor laws, but those factors make such a significant difference that any other factor

I never said that we're uncompetitive solely because of environmental and labor laws, but those factors make such a significant difference that any other factors become irrelevant. We could have all the cheap capital in the world but it would still be cheaper to manufacture in China, Taiwan or other parts of Asia where people work 50,60+ hour weeks for lower pay and no benefits or vacation. > Making sure specific environment-related rules are followed for certain products coming in is much smaller than just a ban. And how do you propose we enforce that against untrustworthy or even hostile governments that have a history of covering things up and a vested interest to do it again?

robertlagrant 3y ago
> We could have all the cheap capital in the world but it would still be cheaper to manufacture in China, Taiwan or other parts of Asia where people work 50,60+ hour weeks for lower pay and no benefits or vacation. What about the US? If 75% of Intel's fabbing is done in the US, that should show us something. An EU-based company that sent 25% of its fabbing off to China would also be much better than protectionist laws. Why can't it be made?
- dns_snek 3y ago
  What are you talking about? I don't know where they currently stand but Intel used to produce the vast majority of their chips in Asia. US government had to introduce very similar incentives and decided to just hand out dozens of billions of dollars to get them to move production back home, which is arguably worse than what you're criticizing the EU for.
  - robertlagrant 3y ago
    > What are you talking about? I'm talking about Intel doing manufacturing in the US. > I don't know where they currently stand but Intel used to produce the vast majority of their chips in Asia. Can you cite this? E.g. Intel seems to have said something quite different in this press report[0]. > US government had to introduce very similar incentives and decided to just hand out dozens of billions of dollars to get them to move production back home Can you cite this? > which is arguably worse than what you're criticizing the EU for Anything is arguable. It's also arguable it's better. I think it's better, personally. [0] https://web.archive.org/web/20110302101731/http://newsroom.intel.com/servlet/JiveServlet/download/1882-25-3841/US_Manufacturing.pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20110302101731/http://newsroom.i...

robertlagrant 3y ago

> We could have all the cheap capital in the world but it would still be cheaper to manufacture in China, Taiwan or other parts of Asia where people work 50,60+ hour weeks for lower pay and no benefits or vacation. What about the US? If 75% of Intel's fabbing is done in the US, that should show us something. An EU-based company that sent 25% of its fabbing off to China would also be much better than protectionist laws. Why can't it be made?

dns_snek 3y ago
What are you talking about? I don't know where they currently stand but Intel used to produce the vast majority of their chips in Asia. US government had to introduce very similar incentives and decided to just hand out dozens of billions of dollars to get them to move production back home, which is arguably worse than what you're criticizing the EU for.
- robertlagrant 3y ago
  > What are you talking about? I'm talking about Intel doing manufacturing in the US. > I don't know where they currently stand but Intel used to produce the vast majority of their chips in Asia. Can you cite this? E.g. Intel seems to have said something quite different in this press report[0]. > US government had to introduce very similar incentives and decided to just hand out dozens of billions of dollars to get them to move production back home Can you cite this? > which is arguably worse than what you're criticizing the EU for Anything is arguable. It's also arguable it's better. I think it's better, personally. [0] https://web.archive.org/web/20110302101731/http://newsroom.intel.com/servlet/JiveServlet/download/1882-25-3841/US_Manufacturing.pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20110302101731/http://newsroom.i...