4 ms·

Why even bother? Wayland is on it's way out and will go down in history as the worst managed piece of system architecture in history. After year 16 (!) the resp

by sprash 3y ago

Why even bother? Wayland is on it's way out and will go down in history as the worst managed piece of system architecture in history. After year 16 (!) the responsible "committee" still has not figured out how to deal with window icons[1] or how to do drag and drop properly[2]. It's an absolute farce that needs to end soon. 1.: https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland-protocols/-/merge_requests/269 https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland-protocols/-/m... 2.: https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland-protocols/-/merge_requests/204 https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland-protocols/-/m...

PlutoIsAPlanet 3y ago
I look forward to your alternative, that also is compatible and optimal with the modern way graphics hardware works (Xorg isn't).
- sprash 3y ago
  Xorg + DRI3 uses the exact same buffer swap mechanism as Wayland. Wayland is basically just a very over engineered protocol to blit some bitmaps. How exactly is Wayland more optimal for modern hardware?
  - bzzzt 3y ago
    If all you want to do is blit some bitmaps it's Xorg that's the overengineered protocol and you're better off using Wayland. You'll even get better security as a bonus...
ceearrbee 3y ago
What sort of nonsense is this? Wayland is the opposite of "on the way out". XOrg has been made the secondary option on a variety of distros for the last few years[1], and there are plans to fully depreciate it in the near-medium term[2]. It is far from a "farce" and your proof, if you read the discussions you provided are for corner cases and specific implementations that go against the explicit and specific designs of what the protocol should do. You're purposefully misleading the discussion (which is fantastic - Godot being Wayland native is a huge success and benefit for the engine on Linux). [1] https://www.ubuntubuzz.com/2021/10/distros-which-adopted-wayland-in-2021.html https://www.ubuntubuzz.com/2021/10/distros-which-adopted-way... [2] https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/rhel-10-plans-wayland-and-xorg-server https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/rhel-10-plans-wayland-and-xor...
- sprash 3y ago
  If window icons and drag and drop are corner cases "that go against the explicit and specific designs of what the protocol should do" the "specific designs of what the protocol should do" are clearly wrong. Besides that, only RedHat and Collabora consultants are pushing for Wayland. People that actually use their computer (as in requiring e.g. drag and drop to work properly) stay on X11 and have done so for the last 16 years.
  - c-hendricks 3y ago
    You're being a little disingenuous. Window Icons exist in Wayland, there's nothing stopping a compositor from adding an icon to their decorations. That proposal is about windows being able to set their own icon. And drag and drop exists in Wayland. I can detach a tab from my browser and a new window appears and moves with the mouse. It seems that proposal was to replace an unstable protocol.

by sprash 3y ago

PlutoIsAPlanet 3y ago

I look forward to your alternative, that also is compatible and optimal with the modern way graphics hardware works (Xorg isn't).

sprash 3y ago
Xorg + DRI3 uses the exact same buffer swap mechanism as Wayland. Wayland is basically just a very over engineered protocol to blit some bitmaps. How exactly is Wayland more optimal for modern hardware?
- bzzzt 3y ago
  If all you want to do is blit some bitmaps it's Xorg that's the overengineered protocol and you're better off using Wayland. You'll even get better security as a bonus...

ceearrbee 3y ago

What sort of nonsense is this? Wayland is the opposite of "on the way out". XOrg has been made the secondary option on a variety of distros for the last few years[1], and there are plans to fully depreciate it in the near-medium term[2]. It is far from a "farce" and your proof, if you read the discussions you provided are for corner cases and specific implementations that go against the explicit and specific designs of what the protocol should do. You're purposefully misleading the discussion (which is fantastic - Godot being Wayland native is a huge success and benefit for the engine on Linux). [1] https://www.ubuntubuzz.com/2021/10/distros-which-adopted-wayland-in-2021.html https://www.ubuntubuzz.com/2021/10/distros-which-adopted-way... [2] https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/rhel-10-plans-wayland-and-xorg-server https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/rhel-10-plans-wayland-and-xor...

sprash 3y ago
If window icons and drag and drop are corner cases "that go against the explicit and specific designs of what the protocol should do" the "specific designs of what the protocol should do" are clearly wrong. Besides that, only RedHat and Collabora consultants are pushing for Wayland. People that actually use their computer (as in requiring e.g. drag and drop to work properly) stay on X11 and have done so for the last 16 years.
- c-hendricks 3y ago
  You're being a little disingenuous. Window Icons exist in Wayland, there's nothing stopping a compositor from adding an icon to their decorations. That proposal is about windows being able to set their own icon. And drag and drop exists in Wayland. I can detach a tab from my browser and a new window appears and moves with the mouse. It seems that proposal was to replace an unstable protocol.