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As someone who made a million dollars on Tesla stock, I'm ready to backdate a new package with better language any time.

ImPostingOnHN 3y ago
I am glad he's staying on, even without the compensation package, just like many said he would (proving the package was excessive), and is still going to perform as CEO, just like many said he would (again proving that the package was excessive). I am skeptical he would be able to extract the same amount of value from out of the pockets of shareholders and into his, without resorting to the fraud he used to gain shareholder approval the first time. We'll see!
- enslavedrobot 3y ago
  The apparent "fraud" was that the board was not independent not that the package was unfair to shareholders. I would absolutely vote for any compensation package that payed a CEO 1% per doubling of my investment. Shareholders will pass a package that contains appropriate legalese so that the options will be reinstated. We can afford it.
  - ImPostingOnHN 3y ago
    There's no need to put fraud in quotes, or inappropriately add "apparent". In fact, let's capitalize it to drive the point home: elmu Definitely Committed Fraud to try to trick shareholders into forking over tens of billions of their own wealth, directly into his pockets. It was an open and shut case, and he was judged guilty of having done so. I doubt shareholders will pass it again*, since the way he got it to pass the first time was by defrauding them. Remember: elmu committed fraud (multiple times, this is just the latest!) There's no escaping that. He's a fraudster in the eyes of the law (though perhaps not in the eyes of his fans). As for your investment, just imagine how much it's worth now that 50 billion dollars of company wealth is staying with the company and investing in even higher returns (!) rather than into elmu's pocket, so he can waste it on another twitter on which to shitpost. elmu having that money wouldn't have increased the stock price over him not having it, but the company having it, probably will. So congrats on your increased future wealth! Remember, too, the judge found, according to the evidence, including elmu and tesla's own statements, that he was motivated to perform even without the additional 50 billion in compensation on top of his existing compensation. So there was never any risk of him performing differently with or without, as judged by the judge of the matter. * Honestly, I doubt it'll even get to a vote, and that he'll even be offered the same package when he has to negotiate against new people representing the interests of shareholders, rather than "negotiating" (*wink*) against his friends.
    - enslavedrobot 3y ago
      I hope you take the time to understand why you are wrong when the compensation package with altered language is passed overwhelmingly by shareholders. My Tesla investment has gone up 1200% and extra 10% means nothing to me. The deal we shareholders struck with the CEO in 2018 was more than fair and I was not cheated in any way. My daughters will never have to endure the drudgery I did thanks to Tesla, one of the greatest and fastest growing manufacturing companies in the history of the world. Weaseling out of the compensation package that made it happen because a judge thinks I didn't know Musk's brother wasn't an independent board member is absurd. It's amazing to me that people can't just look at the numbers and understand why the pay package was a great deal. I hope that when the shareholders re-approve it you take a step back and try to understand why Tesla is such a special company.
      - ImPostingOnHN 3y ago
        Now imagine the good that 50 billion more dollars is going to do Tesla and shareholders, rather than elmu. Imagine: Tesla making more, better new models, instead of elmu buying gab and shitposting there next. Imagine: Tesla expanding their charger technology and network, instead of elmu bribing more sexual harassment victims with more racehorses ("hush-horses", perhaps? ;). Our families are going to do so much better now that that money is in the right hands, and I am happy for both of us: we're now both, literally, materially, better off by the 50B alone, soon to be moreso after Tesla invests it into Tesla instead of forking it over to a shitposting, sexually harassing fraudster. > The deal we shareholders struck with the CEO in 2018 was more than fair and I was not cheated in any way. It wasn't, as judged by the judge [0], and you were, as judged by the judge [0]. It sounds like you're saying that you're okay with elmu having defrauded you (inarguable at this point, what with the judge's judgement [0]). Or maybe that you don't like how the judge of the matter judged the matter. Both of those are different from him not doing it. Also, it wasn't struck by shareholders, it was struck corruptly between elmu and his friends, as judged by the judge [0], and then only approved by shareholders after elmu's defrauding of shareholders, as judged by the judge [0]. Yes, elmu is legally a multiple time fraudster, and no amount of bare assertions to the contrary will change that fact, and no amount of spouting "wrong!" at people who point that out will change that fact, and no amount of insulting me on HN will change that fact. Consider bringing references next time you make such a claim (especially about me personally), like I did, in citing the judgement which describes elmu's latest legal fraud [0]. [0]: (PDF warning) https://assets.bwbx.io/documents/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/rpaOEefQse00/v0 https://assets.bwbx.io/documents/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/rpaOEefQ...

ImPostingOnHN 3y ago

I am glad he's staying on, even without the compensation package, just like many said he would (proving the package was excessive), and is still going to perform as CEO, just like many said he would (again proving that the package was excessive). I am skeptical he would be able to extract the same amount of value from out of the pockets of shareholders and into his, without resorting to the fraud he used to gain shareholder approval the first time. We'll see!

enslavedrobot 3y ago
The apparent "fraud" was that the board was not independent not that the package was unfair to shareholders. I would absolutely vote for any compensation package that payed a CEO 1% per doubling of my investment. Shareholders will pass a package that contains appropriate legalese so that the options will be reinstated. We can afford it.
- ImPostingOnHN 3y ago
  There's no need to put fraud in quotes, or inappropriately add "apparent". In fact, let's capitalize it to drive the point home: elmu Definitely Committed Fraud to try to trick shareholders into forking over tens of billions of their own wealth, directly into his pockets. It was an open and shut case, and he was judged guilty of having done so. I doubt shareholders will pass it again*, since the way he got it to pass the first time was by defrauding them. Remember: elmu committed fraud (multiple times, this is just the latest!) There's no escaping that. He's a fraudster in the eyes of the law (though perhaps not in the eyes of his fans). As for your investment, just imagine how much it's worth now that 50 billion dollars of company wealth is staying with the company and investing in even higher returns (!) rather than into elmu's pocket, so he can waste it on another twitter on which to shitpost. elmu having that money wouldn't have increased the stock price over him not having it, but the company having it, probably will. So congrats on your increased future wealth! Remember, too, the judge found, according to the evidence, including elmu and tesla's own statements, that he was motivated to perform even without the additional 50 billion in compensation on top of his existing compensation. So there was never any risk of him performing differently with or without, as judged by the judge of the matter. * Honestly, I doubt it'll even get to a vote, and that he'll even be offered the same package when he has to negotiate against new people representing the interests of shareholders, rather than "negotiating" (*wink*) against his friends.
  - enslavedrobot 3y ago
    I hope you take the time to understand why you are wrong when the compensation package with altered language is passed overwhelmingly by shareholders. My Tesla investment has gone up 1200% and extra 10% means nothing to me. The deal we shareholders struck with the CEO in 2018 was more than fair and I was not cheated in any way. My daughters will never have to endure the drudgery I did thanks to Tesla, one of the greatest and fastest growing manufacturing companies in the history of the world. Weaseling out of the compensation package that made it happen because a judge thinks I didn't know Musk's brother wasn't an independent board member is absurd. It's amazing to me that people can't just look at the numbers and understand why the pay package was a great deal. I hope that when the shareholders re-approve it you take a step back and try to understand why Tesla is such a special company.
    - ImPostingOnHN 3y ago
      Now imagine the good that 50 billion more dollars is going to do Tesla and shareholders, rather than elmu. Imagine: Tesla making more, better new models, instead of elmu buying gab and shitposting there next. Imagine: Tesla expanding their charger technology and network, instead of elmu bribing more sexual harassment victims with more racehorses ("hush-horses", perhaps? ;). Our families are going to do so much better now that that money is in the right hands, and I am happy for both of us: we're now both, literally, materially, better off by the 50B alone, soon to be moreso after Tesla invests it into Tesla instead of forking it over to a shitposting, sexually harassing fraudster. > The deal we shareholders struck with the CEO in 2018 was more than fair and I was not cheated in any way. It wasn't, as judged by the judge [0], and you were, as judged by the judge [0]. It sounds like you're saying that you're okay with elmu having defrauded you (inarguable at this point, what with the judge's judgement [0]). Or maybe that you don't like how the judge of the matter judged the matter. Both of those are different from him not doing it. Also, it wasn't struck by shareholders, it was struck corruptly between elmu and his friends, as judged by the judge [0], and then only approved by shareholders after elmu's defrauding of shareholders, as judged by the judge [0]. Yes, elmu is legally a multiple time fraudster, and no amount of bare assertions to the contrary will change that fact, and no amount of spouting "wrong!" at people who point that out will change that fact, and no amount of insulting me on HN will change that fact. Consider bringing references next time you make such a claim (especially about me personally), like I did, in citing the judgement which describes elmu's latest legal fraud [0]. [0]: (PDF warning) https://assets.bwbx.io/documents/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/rpaOEefQse00/v0 https://assets.bwbx.io/documents/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/rpaOEefQ...