3 ms·

My guess is that widespread 24-bit support in terminal apps is still held back by the fact that the macOS terminal still doesn't support it. As far as I can tel

by moyix 3y ago

My guess is that widespread 24-bit support in terminal apps is still held back by the fact that the macOS terminal still doesn't support it. As far as I can tell nearly everything else does :(

lxgr 3y ago
Is that really a good reason to not support it? It seems possible to offer graceful degradation for non-supporting terminals, and I'd be surprised if the number of Terminal.app users that would even notice the difference would be that high: Surely everybody who cares about a good terminal experience uses some third-party client already? Then again, maybe I'm underestimating managed/corporate devices that don't allow third-party terminal emulators, since they do have quite critical access in the end.
- moyix 3y ago
  It's the default, which means it has a lot of people use it. And IME the alternatives on mac aren't very good.
  - alwillis 3y ago
    IME, this is like the golden age of terminal apps in general and macOS-compatible ones in particular. There are several really good terminals for macOS: iTerm2: (https://iterm2.com/ https://iterm2.com/) Kitty terminal (https://sw.kovidgoyal.net/kitty/ https://sw.kovidgoyal.net/kitty/) WezTerm termina (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/index.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/index.html) Alacritty (https://github.com/alacritty/alacritty https://github.com/alacritty/alacritty) My daily driver is WezTerm… - Runs on Linux, macOS, Windows 10 and FreeBSD - Multiplex terminal panes, tabs and windows on local and remote hosts, with native mouse and scrollback (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/multiplexing.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/multiplexing.html) - Ligatures (https://github.com/tonsky/FiraCode#fira-code-monospaced-font-with-programming-ligatures https://github.com/tonsky/FiraCode#fira-code-monospaced-font...), Color Emoji and font fallback, with true color and dynamic color schemes (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/config/appearance.html#colors https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/config/appearance.html#colors). - Hyperlinks (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/hyperlinks.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/hyperlinks.html) - Searchable Scrollback (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/scrollback.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/scrollback.html) (use mouse wheel and `Shift-PageUp` and `Shift PageDown` to navigate, Ctrl-Shift-F to activate search mode) - xterm style selection of text with mouse; paste selection via `Shift-Insert` (bracketed paste is supported!) - SGR style mouse reporting (works in vim and tmux) - Render underline, double-underline, italic, bold, strikethrough (most other terminal emulators do not support as many render attributes) - Configuration via a configuration file (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/config/files.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/config/files.html) with hot reloading - Multiple Windows (Hotkey: `Super-N`) - Splits/Panes (Split horizontally/vertically: `Ctrl-Shift-Alt-%` and `Ctrl-Shift-Alt-"`, move between panes: `Ctrl-Shift-ArrowKey`) - Tabs (Hotkey: `Super-T`, next/prev: `Super-Shift-[` and `Super-Shift-]`, go-to: `Super-[1-9]`) - SSH client with native tabs (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/ssh.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/ssh.html) - Connect to serial ports for embedded/Arduino work (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/serial.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/serial.html) - Connect to a local multiplexer server over unix domain sockets - Connect to a remote multiplexer using SSH or TLS over TCP/IP - iTerm2 compatible image protocol support, and built-in imgcat command (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/imgcat.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/imgcat.html) - Kitty graphics support - Sixel graphics support (experimental: starting in `20200620-160318-e00b076c`)
- electroly 3y ago
  > Surely everybody who cares about a good terminal experience uses some third-party client already? Unclear. The built-in Terminal app is pretty good otherwise, and true color isn't necessary for a lot (most?) of common terminal usage. It's not so poor that all command line users would definitely have a third party app.
bhaak 3y ago
If you are not using iTerm2 on macOS, it's your own fault.
- moyix 3y ago
  Tried it. Slow, uses lots of memory.
  - mattigames 3y ago
    Yeah, that's my experience as well, I find ConEmu on Windows to also be a bit slow.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- simonmic 3y ago
  Used it for years, but the options are out of control, labyrinthine. I gave up trying to keep everything behaving like I wanted.
m463 3y ago
I wonder if this is terminal.app or the terminfo entry. My system seems to have TERM=xterm-256color I wonder what would happen with a 24-bit color terminfo file.

by moyix 3y ago

My guess is that widespread 24-bit support in terminal apps is still held back by the fact that the macOS terminal still doesn't support it. As far as I can tell nearly everything else does :(

lxgr 3y ago

Is that really a good reason to not support it? It seems possible to offer graceful degradation for non-supporting terminals, and I'd be surprised if the number of Terminal.app users that would even notice the difference would be that high: Surely everybody who cares about a good terminal experience uses some third-party client already? Then again, maybe I'm underestimating managed/corporate devices that don't allow third-party terminal emulators, since they do have quite critical access in the end.

moyix 3y ago
It's the default, which means it has a lot of people use it. And IME the alternatives on mac aren't very good.
- alwillis 3y ago
  IME, this is like the golden age of terminal apps in general and macOS-compatible ones in particular. There are several really good terminals for macOS: iTerm2: (https://iterm2.com/ https://iterm2.com/) Kitty terminal (https://sw.kovidgoyal.net/kitty/ https://sw.kovidgoyal.net/kitty/) WezTerm termina (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/index.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/index.html) Alacritty (https://github.com/alacritty/alacritty https://github.com/alacritty/alacritty) My daily driver is WezTerm… - Runs on Linux, macOS, Windows 10 and FreeBSD - Multiplex terminal panes, tabs and windows on local and remote hosts, with native mouse and scrollback (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/multiplexing.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/multiplexing.html) - Ligatures (https://github.com/tonsky/FiraCode#fira-code-monospaced-font-with-programming-ligatures https://github.com/tonsky/FiraCode#fira-code-monospaced-font...), Color Emoji and font fallback, with true color and dynamic color schemes (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/config/appearance.html#colors https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/config/appearance.html#colors). - Hyperlinks (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/hyperlinks.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/hyperlinks.html) - Searchable Scrollback (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/scrollback.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/scrollback.html) (use mouse wheel and `Shift-PageUp` and `Shift PageDown` to navigate, Ctrl-Shift-F to activate search mode) - xterm style selection of text with mouse; paste selection via `Shift-Insert` (bracketed paste is supported!) - SGR style mouse reporting (works in vim and tmux) - Render underline, double-underline, italic, bold, strikethrough (most other terminal emulators do not support as many render attributes) - Configuration via a configuration file (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/config/files.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/config/files.html) with hot reloading - Multiple Windows (Hotkey: `Super-N`) - Splits/Panes (Split horizontally/vertically: `Ctrl-Shift-Alt-%` and `Ctrl-Shift-Alt-"`, move between panes: `Ctrl-Shift-ArrowKey`) - Tabs (Hotkey: `Super-T`, next/prev: `Super-Shift-[` and `Super-Shift-]`, go-to: `Super-[1-9]`) - SSH client with native tabs (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/ssh.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/ssh.html) - Connect to serial ports for embedded/Arduino work (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/serial.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/serial.html) - Connect to a local multiplexer server over unix domain sockets - Connect to a remote multiplexer using SSH or TLS over TCP/IP - iTerm2 compatible image protocol support, and built-in imgcat command (https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/imgcat.html https://wezfurlong.org/wezterm/imgcat.html) - Kitty graphics support - Sixel graphics support (experimental: starting in `20200620-160318-e00b076c`)
electroly 3y ago
> Surely everybody who cares about a good terminal experience uses some third-party client already? Unclear. The built-in Terminal app is pretty good otherwise, and true color isn't necessary for a lot (most?) of common terminal usage. It's not so poor that all command line users would definitely have a third party app.

bhaak 3y ago

If you are not using iTerm2 on macOS, it's your own fault.

moyix 3y ago
Tried it. Slow, uses lots of memory.
- mattigames 3y ago
  Yeah, that's my experience as well, I find ConEmu on Windows to also be a bit slow.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
simonmic 3y ago
Used it for years, but the options are out of control, labyrinthine. I gave up trying to keep everything behaving like I wanted.

m463 3y ago

I wonder if this is terminal.app or the terminfo entry. My system seems to have TERM=xterm-256color I wonder what would happen with a 24-bit color terminfo file.