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John Deere & SpaceX , a match made in hell. Hopefully the world will end before they spice up their marriage and extend the offer to Tesla. Technically it mak

John Deere & SpaceX , a match made in hell. Hopefully the world will end before they spice up their marriage and extend the offer to Tesla. Technically it makes some sense, but most of the push is because for more "data, intelligence, cloud, AI" in order to get more "value" to big agrobusinesses or anyone who can pay to stay in the party. Agriculture is already a massive business only a few gigantic corporations can be in. The old romantic notion of the family farm has been dying at a rapid pace in the last few decades, also, monocultures to the max! My ironic comments are mostly due to the way John Deere does business almost perfectly align with Musk's recipe for Tesla and SpaceX to an extent. The blindingly brightness of this future is so bleak at the same time.

danjc 3y ago
Have you seen the cybertractor?
voakbasda 3y ago
Small family farming is already dead unless (a) you are willing to turn a large fortune into a small one or (b) you are willing to live in poverty.
- CuriouslyC 3y ago
  Not entirely true, small family farming can compete in niche, specialty and high end produce, they can capitalize on having a pretty farm (because "real" farms are incredibly ugly but people have pastoral fantasies), and farm stands can be profitable if they're in the right location.
  - don_neufeld 3y ago
    That’s true, but it’s also exceptionally rare. In that version, you are fundamentally not a farmer, you are a marketer. Source: grew up in a farm town. Go Wheat Kings!
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - mcbishop 3y ago
      I disagree. If your soil is depleted and dead, under sprawling petrochemical monocrops... you are fundamentally not a farmer.
- tastyfreeze 3y ago
  Farmers in every generation of my family's existence in the US. The current ones are decidedly not poor. Maybe not a lot of free time but not poor.
  - dogman144 3y ago
    This is my experience as well. Ranchers and farmers that are established are quite wealthy. Maybe sometimes that's paper wealth or paired with seasonal debt up to their eyeballs. Also probably some extremely single-threaded dependencies (JD and JD authorized repair outlets, seed strains, etc).
    - tastyfreeze 3y ago
      Agreed that a lot of it may be paper wealth. Farming is capital intensive. Having a successful farm often means hundreds of thousands to millions in equipment and infrastructure. Anybody with that kind of capital is absolutely not poor.
      - dogman144 3y ago
        Ya, usually paired with significant political capital as well. Ranchers in the west make up a mess of state legislatures, are strong conservation advocates (although in an indirect/slightly selfish way), and so on. If I had the money to plan for and survive the land-value tax issue, I'd probably buy a mess of land and hand it back over to an operator.
  - voakbasda 3y ago
    To be clear, I was speaking more toward starting new family farms. Few families can afford to invest the capital required to compete with families like yours that have inherited generational wealth. Put those assets on a balance sheet charted over time, and I suspect their net value has decreased relative to their productive returns. If so, that’s a large fortune turned into a small one. Do you honestly think your family could start from scratch and still successfully compete in a saturated commodity market entrenched with others in such a position? And don’t talk to be about nice markets, because that’s far less farming and much more marketing (as another commenter pointed out).
CuriouslyC 3y ago
Don't worry, when we ruin soil fertility and the population collapses due to loss of farmland from global warming, all this will self-correct.
- NavinF 3y ago
  Do you actually believe that will happen? How much do you want to bet?
  - CuriouslyC 3y ago
    We'll destroy civilization through social unrest before our technology fails to keep us on life support, that doesn't mean there won't be serious losses of life quality for those not blessed with wealth, and the loss of food quality/diversity and habitable land due to climate and habitat damage is both unquestionable and will play a significant role in precipitating the decline. I'll happily take bets on that statement of whatever amount you're willing to lose.
liotier 3y ago
> extend the offer to Tesla Coming soon to John Deer: electric automotive technology licensed from Tesla.
turing_complete 3y ago
What's so great about a family farm? We're much better off without 90% of the population being poor, self-subsistence farmers.
- the_other 3y ago
  That's like saying "what's so great about start-ups/bootstrapped tech firms?". You really want a tiny handful of rich incumbents owning all the land? That's never worked out well before.
  - Towaway69 3y ago
    Let's do the numbers: 8 billion people. Never before have we been so many. Success! Something must be going right. Pity everyone is competing for fewer jobs and AI is just entering the market. Quality of life has always been overrated. It might sound cynical but quality of life depends largely on which side you are on: rich or poor?
- pphysch 3y ago
  This is where conventional poverty metrics can be extremely counterproductive. A subsistence farmer could be materially much better off than a homeless or low class person in the city, but superficial poverty metrics suggest the opposite because the farmer technically has no income while the homeless person has some amount of welfare support. Whether by accident or not, neoliberal economics says we need fewer farmers and more min wage serfs. Besides, we live in the 21st century, it is possible to be both a remote subsistence farmer and an educated+connected person at the same time, and the efficiency of small scale farming can be massively boosted with the use of modern tech such as networked sensors, camera drones, AI, etc.
- lm28469 3y ago
  The thing is research tend to show pre industrial revolution poor farmers had a better time than our modern poors. Unless we consider owning lots of gadgets makes someone rich
  - 3y ago
brandonagr2 3y ago
All Tesla cars are already constantly connected to the internet via cell network, not sure what you mean by extend the offer to Tesla. The recipe for Tesla and SpaceX are to offer the best product (Model Y is the best selling vehicle in the world and Starlink is taking over because no one offers satellite internet anywhere close to as good), how does that align with John Deere selling tractors as a service?

danjc 3y ago

Have you seen the cybertractor?

voakbasda 3y ago

Small family farming is already dead unless (a) you are willing to turn a large fortune into a small one or (b) you are willing to live in poverty.

CuriouslyC 3y ago
Not entirely true, small family farming can compete in niche, specialty and high end produce, they can capitalize on having a pretty farm (because "real" farms are incredibly ugly but people have pastoral fantasies), and farm stands can be profitable if they're in the right location.
- don_neufeld 3y ago
  That’s true, but it’s also exceptionally rare. In that version, you are fundamentally not a farmer, you are a marketer. Source: grew up in a farm town. Go Wheat Kings!
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - mcbishop 3y ago
    I disagree. If your soil is depleted and dead, under sprawling petrochemical monocrops... you are fundamentally not a farmer.
tastyfreeze 3y ago
Farmers in every generation of my family's existence in the US. The current ones are decidedly not poor. Maybe not a lot of free time but not poor.
- dogman144 3y ago
  This is my experience as well. Ranchers and farmers that are established are quite wealthy. Maybe sometimes that's paper wealth or paired with seasonal debt up to their eyeballs. Also probably some extremely single-threaded dependencies (JD and JD authorized repair outlets, seed strains, etc).
  - tastyfreeze 3y ago
    Agreed that a lot of it may be paper wealth. Farming is capital intensive. Having a successful farm often means hundreds of thousands to millions in equipment and infrastructure. Anybody with that kind of capital is absolutely not poor.
    - dogman144 3y ago
      Ya, usually paired with significant political capital as well. Ranchers in the west make up a mess of state legislatures, are strong conservation advocates (although in an indirect/slightly selfish way), and so on. If I had the money to plan for and survive the land-value tax issue, I'd probably buy a mess of land and hand it back over to an operator.
- voakbasda 3y ago
  To be clear, I was speaking more toward starting new family farms. Few families can afford to invest the capital required to compete with families like yours that have inherited generational wealth. Put those assets on a balance sheet charted over time, and I suspect their net value has decreased relative to their productive returns. If so, that’s a large fortune turned into a small one. Do you honestly think your family could start from scratch and still successfully compete in a saturated commodity market entrenched with others in such a position? And don’t talk to be about nice markets, because that’s far less farming and much more marketing (as another commenter pointed out).

CuriouslyC 3y ago

Don't worry, when we ruin soil fertility and the population collapses due to loss of farmland from global warming, all this will self-correct.

NavinF 3y ago
Do you actually believe that will happen? How much do you want to bet?
- CuriouslyC 3y ago
  We'll destroy civilization through social unrest before our technology fails to keep us on life support, that doesn't mean there won't be serious losses of life quality for those not blessed with wealth, and the loss of food quality/diversity and habitable land due to climate and habitat damage is both unquestionable and will play a significant role in precipitating the decline. I'll happily take bets on that statement of whatever amount you're willing to lose.

liotier 3y ago

> extend the offer to Tesla Coming soon to John Deer: electric automotive technology licensed from Tesla.

turing_complete 3y ago

What's so great about a family farm? We're much better off without 90% of the population being poor, self-subsistence farmers.

the_other 3y ago
That's like saying "what's so great about start-ups/bootstrapped tech firms?". You really want a tiny handful of rich incumbents owning all the land? That's never worked out well before.
- Towaway69 3y ago
  Let's do the numbers: 8 billion people. Never before have we been so many. Success! Something must be going right. Pity everyone is competing for fewer jobs and AI is just entering the market. Quality of life has always been overrated. It might sound cynical but quality of life depends largely on which side you are on: rich or poor?
pphysch 3y ago
This is where conventional poverty metrics can be extremely counterproductive. A subsistence farmer could be materially much better off than a homeless or low class person in the city, but superficial poverty metrics suggest the opposite because the farmer technically has no income while the homeless person has some amount of welfare support. Whether by accident or not, neoliberal economics says we need fewer farmers and more min wage serfs. Besides, we live in the 21st century, it is possible to be both a remote subsistence farmer and an educated+connected person at the same time, and the efficiency of small scale farming can be massively boosted with the use of modern tech such as networked sensors, camera drones, AI, etc.
lm28469 3y ago
The thing is research tend to show pre industrial revolution poor farmers had a better time than our modern poors. Unless we consider owning lots of gadgets makes someone rich
- 3y ago

brandonagr2 3y ago

All Tesla cars are already constantly connected to the internet via cell network, not sure what you mean by extend the offer to Tesla. The recipe for Tesla and SpaceX are to offer the best product (Model Y is the best selling vehicle in the world and Starlink is taking over because no one offers satellite internet anywhere close to as good), how does that align with John Deere selling tractors as a service?