5 ms·

Is it just me who finds these little spats between huge companies a little tedious? It doesn't affect my life, or my work, if Microsoft or Adobe or Apple takes

Is it just me who finds these little spats between huge companies a little tedious? It doesn't affect my life, or my work, if Microsoft or Adobe or Apple takes Google or Motorola or Samsung to court for another expensive round of willy-waving. I find it incredibly hard to want to cheer for any of these organisations, or get behind any of this stuff. These are just big, faceless corporations, each the same as the next, when it comes down to it. It's a bit like supporting professional sports teams, I guess.

m0nty 14y ago
My "take-away" from all this is that, if this can affect Microsoft so profoundly, how much more damage could be done to startups and small businesses in the technology arena? Most of them couldn't afford the fees to start the legal process, let alone pay for a protracted fight on obscure areas of copyright.
- hef19898 14y ago
  It could actually kill a lot of them. Patents are just fine as long as they are used defesivly. If they are not they can ruin everything. Some effects I can imagine: - Potential competitors aren't bought but sued to death. - It could be harder to get founding if your situation is not sure, investors could loose their money Consequence will be that start-ups will become more expensive again...
  - rbanffy 14y ago
    > Patents are just fine as long as they are used defesivly Not really. Good patents are fine, but in order to use a patent defensively, you'll have to defend against something, most likely the abuse of an actual patent (be it a good one or not). And it's certainly sweet to see Microsoft tasting its own poison. They have extorted just about every Android set maker (or Linux embedder) with a secret list of patents they paid Barnes & Noble US$ 300 million to keep secret. BTW, this seems to be the soft spot of their armor - future litigants should press hard for the list to be made public. Microsoft will settle before risking exposing a weak hand.
  - biot 14y ago
    If patents are only good if used defensively (because someone else threatens you with a patent infringement claim) then this is similar to having no patents at all. The difference is that if you abolish patents, patentable aspects of a product will become trade secrets rather than shared in a patent filing.
- r00fus 14y ago
  Take a look at Nest... it might very well be the nice high impenetrable barrier that $megacorps use to insulate themselves from disruptive challenges.
nickik 14y ago
The lawers are happy about it. The law we have are just made in a way that it is still worth fighting instead of producing. I am not an expert on the law in general but I know that a lot could be much easier.
JohnnyFlash 14y ago
When I grew up my dad wanted me to be a business man. When my kid grows up I want him to be a patent troll. When I was young the money was in innovation. Now the money is in stifling it. I agree though. Tedious describes this perfectly.
- bad_user 14y ago
  I love this quote from The Pirate Bay blog, probably paraphrased from a proverb or something: In this year of the storm, the winners will build windmills and the losers will raise shelters. The world will keep on turning and innovators will find ways around any problems raised by the current laws. Either that, or our governments will start getting overthrown again. Personally I wouldn't want my son to be a patent troll, simply because this is an artifact of the modern world, which can change in the blink of an eye, leaving my son with no occupation. However, the constant truth is that people creating value have always earned enough money to keep them satisfied.
MichaelGG 14y ago
Well, I like Xbox and Windows 7, and have only had a bad experience with Motorola. Even so, the optimist in me is really happy about this. The reasoning is that if stuff gets screwed up enough, really having stuff messed up, then something might give and things might get better. Imagine a wonderfully chaotic future where iPads can't be sold one week, Xboxes another, and so on. It'd certainly further help illustrate the absurdity and innovation-limiting inherent in patents. Realistically, I know it probably won't amount to much. Motorola and Microsoft will fight, come to some settlement, and the world will be worse off with yet another precedent set for legal abuse instead of actual competition.
- iamgopal 14y ago
  Things such as this ultimately prevent small medium company from entering the market. The wall is getting higher and higher.
  - chives 14y ago
    I guess the fact that Google put them up to it as retaliation for the fact that MS did the exact same thing to them is lost on this thread. Did you know Microsoft makes more money licensing Android to Google then it does selling windows phones? Yeah payback is a bitch. Its ok thread goers, lets continue ignoring the real issue here and side with one of the largest patent trolls: MS.
ForrestN 14y ago
It might be tedious because you don't live in Germany. For me, the potential for major products used by millions of people to be banned seems quite important. To make it more relevant, imagine that a major consumer product might be totally banned from sale in your country on the basis of a patent lawsuit. Imagine that, say, the browser you use, or the phone you were hoping to buy, was suddenly banned. That would presumably affect your life, right?
- andyking 14y ago
  Not really. I'd just use another product. I'm not so attached to Chrome, or Android, or iPhone, or any other tech product that I couldn't switch. And aside from that, none of these 'bans' will ever come to pass--they're just lawyers flexing various muscles.
Jun8 14y ago
And why do these bans generally happen in Germany?
- jbigelow76 14y ago
  Maybe a favorable climate in which to sue. I know there is a part of Texas that patent trolls like to bring their suits in due to higher likelihood of the defendant getting screwed. I'm pretty sure it's the same one in which Msft got hammered over their Office/XML patents.
- soc88 14y ago
  ? This is the first time I ever heard of a German court involved. 90% cases have been in East-Texas so far.
lunarscape 14y ago
"It doesn't affect my life, or my work" Unless you buy their products I guess. Lawyers are expensive and I assume that expensive eventually filters down to their customers. I wonder, for example, how much, if anything, consumers have paid for the 'Android tax' Microsoft has been applying to various companies.
tatsuke95 14y ago
Tedious, and expensive. Between the pseudo-bubble valuations and all the IP challenges, in 25 years we're going to look back at this time with disgust at all the wasted resources.

m0nty 14y ago

My "take-away" from all this is that, if this can affect Microsoft so profoundly, how much more damage could be done to startups and small businesses in the technology arena? Most of them couldn't afford the fees to start the legal process, let alone pay for a protracted fight on obscure areas of copyright.

hef19898 14y ago
It could actually kill a lot of them. Patents are just fine as long as they are used defesivly. If they are not they can ruin everything. Some effects I can imagine: - Potential competitors aren't bought but sued to death. - It could be harder to get founding if your situation is not sure, investors could loose their money Consequence will be that start-ups will become more expensive again...
- rbanffy 14y ago
  > Patents are just fine as long as they are used defesivly Not really. Good patents are fine, but in order to use a patent defensively, you'll have to defend against something, most likely the abuse of an actual patent (be it a good one or not). And it's certainly sweet to see Microsoft tasting its own poison. They have extorted just about every Android set maker (or Linux embedder) with a secret list of patents they paid Barnes & Noble US$ 300 million to keep secret. BTW, this seems to be the soft spot of their armor - future litigants should press hard for the list to be made public. Microsoft will settle before risking exposing a weak hand.
- biot 14y ago
  If patents are only good if used defensively (because someone else threatens you with a patent infringement claim) then this is similar to having no patents at all. The difference is that if you abolish patents, patentable aspects of a product will become trade secrets rather than shared in a patent filing.
r00fus 14y ago
Take a look at Nest... it might very well be the nice high impenetrable barrier that $megacorps use to insulate themselves from disruptive challenges.

nickik 14y ago

The lawers are happy about it. The law we have are just made in a way that it is still worth fighting instead of producing. I am not an expert on the law in general but I know that a lot could be much easier.

JohnnyFlash 14y ago

When I grew up my dad wanted me to be a business man. When my kid grows up I want him to be a patent troll. When I was young the money was in innovation. Now the money is in stifling it. I agree though. Tedious describes this perfectly.

bad_user 14y ago
I love this quote from The Pirate Bay blog, probably paraphrased from a proverb or something: In this year of the storm, the winners will build windmills and the losers will raise shelters. The world will keep on turning and innovators will find ways around any problems raised by the current laws. Either that, or our governments will start getting overthrown again. Personally I wouldn't want my son to be a patent troll, simply because this is an artifact of the modern world, which can change in the blink of an eye, leaving my son with no occupation. However, the constant truth is that people creating value have always earned enough money to keep them satisfied.

MichaelGG 14y ago

Well, I like Xbox and Windows 7, and have only had a bad experience with Motorola. Even so, the optimist in me is really happy about this. The reasoning is that if stuff gets screwed up enough, really having stuff messed up, then something might give and things might get better. Imagine a wonderfully chaotic future where iPads can't be sold one week, Xboxes another, and so on. It'd certainly further help illustrate the absurdity and innovation-limiting inherent in patents. Realistically, I know it probably won't amount to much. Motorola and Microsoft will fight, come to some settlement, and the world will be worse off with yet another precedent set for legal abuse instead of actual competition.

iamgopal 14y ago
Things such as this ultimately prevent small medium company from entering the market. The wall is getting higher and higher.
- chives 14y ago
  I guess the fact that Google put them up to it as retaliation for the fact that MS did the exact same thing to them is lost on this thread. Did you know Microsoft makes more money licensing Android to Google then it does selling windows phones? Yeah payback is a bitch. Its ok thread goers, lets continue ignoring the real issue here and side with one of the largest patent trolls: MS.

ForrestN 14y ago

It might be tedious because you don't live in Germany. For me, the potential for major products used by millions of people to be banned seems quite important. To make it more relevant, imagine that a major consumer product might be totally banned from sale in your country on the basis of a patent lawsuit. Imagine that, say, the browser you use, or the phone you were hoping to buy, was suddenly banned. That would presumably affect your life, right?

andyking 14y ago
Not really. I'd just use another product. I'm not so attached to Chrome, or Android, or iPhone, or any other tech product that I couldn't switch. And aside from that, none of these 'bans' will ever come to pass--they're just lawyers flexing various muscles.

Jun8 14y ago

And why do these bans generally happen in Germany?

jbigelow76 14y ago
Maybe a favorable climate in which to sue. I know there is a part of Texas that patent trolls like to bring their suits in due to higher likelihood of the defendant getting screwed. I'm pretty sure it's the same one in which Msft got hammered over their Office/XML patents.
soc88 14y ago
? This is the first time I ever heard of a German court involved. 90% cases have been in East-Texas so far.

lunarscape 14y ago

"It doesn't affect my life, or my work" Unless you buy their products I guess. Lawyers are expensive and I assume that expensive eventually filters down to their customers. I wonder, for example, how much, if anything, consumers have paid for the 'Android tax' Microsoft has been applying to various companies.

tatsuke95 14y ago

Tedious, and expensive. Between the pseudo-bubble valuations and all the IP challenges, in 25 years we're going to look back at this time with disgust at all the wasted resources.