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Do you eat any food made by corporations? Or grown by any corporations? Both lasers and food are regulated in the USA by the FDA AFAIK.

by fhub 3y ago

dylan604 3y ago
Your blind faith in "just because a product is available means it is safe" makes me wonder if you're familiar with the concept of a recall. Across all industries, companies have done something to the point that it is in the public's interest to remove that item from the market. There are so so many e.coli cases, listeria cases haunting the ice cream maker of my childhood to the point i never buy their brand now, and so many other food products that have been recalled for various reasons. I kind of wished I lived in your world that exists in your mind.
- fhub 3y ago
  I'm replying to the comment "I don't trust any corporation in any matter". But that is hard to do in practice. It would just take too much time for an individual to test every food they ever eat. Likewise I'm not going to take apart every product that is CE or CL certified to make sure it meets standards that I'm not even educated on. I don't have blind faith, I have some faith that trusting the certification processes in most matters is more cost effective for me than to verify everything myself. Especially for lasers that have strictly defined classes based on power output. That sort of trust does take on some risk. But I'm content with that level of risk. Things seem much safer now than they did when I was a kid.
  - dylan604 3y ago
    Yes, because no decision made by any gov't body has ever "missed" something. In fact, recalls happen only because of the existence of these bodies. The FAA allowed Boeing to make the MAX series of planes. The CE and CL have certified products that have later been recalled. These agencies aren't perfect. The FDA has allowed things like Olestra. There are plenty of other examples. What's the difference between trusting any corp and trusting any agency? I'd say anyone trusting any corp/agency without any doubt would be somewhat delusional.
    - fhub 3y ago
      I think I understand what you are trying to say. You are saying that me saying "The LIDAR units used by these robot vacuums aren't powerful enough to damage cat/children's eyes. I trust that they wouldn't be on the market if they were." Equates to me trusting every corporation on every safety issue AND that I trust the certifications to be perfect AND I trust nothing ever gets missed. But all three of these is clearly (to me the author) not what I'm saying there. "The LIDAR units used by these robot vacuums aren't powerful enough to damage cat/children's eyes. I trust that they wouldn't be on the market if they were." My elaboration on this is that I trust that those lasers are of low enough power to not damage cat/children's eyes because consumer grade lasers are one of those things that I believe to be well regulated and certified before going on the market. I also happen to think that competitors would be tearing these things down at launch and if they found they were out of compliance they'd be very vocal about it. Then I go onto say "Do you eat any food made by corporations? Or grown by any corporations? Both lasers and food are regulated in the USA by the FDA AFAIK." specifically to someone saying "I don't trust any corporation on any matter". I just find that to be a hard position to take in any practical sense. Society only functions with some level of trust between supplier or consumer.
      - dylan604 3y ago
        your trust that things would not be on the market just seems very rose tinted glasses to me, but maybe my hesitancy in agreeing is slightly misplaced. rather than the blind trust, maybe it would be the "shocked to find out" something slipped past the regulations. we see this happen all the time. for me, the trust isn't there. i'm honestly shocked at this point that i don't get sick from mass produced food, or hurt by any other product. i just let the other animals in the herd go first more than trusting the regulators EDIT: here's a headline from just within the past hour recalling 50,000 cars with a "DO NOT DRIVE" warning[0]. that's from a very heavily regulated industry. these types of things are precisely why "trust" is not really warranted on my part. it's more of just blind acceptance, not trust. [0] https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/toyota-warns-50000-vehicle-owners-stop-driving-get-immediate-repairs-2024-01-29/ https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/toyota...

Do you eat any food made by corporations? Or grown by any corporations? Both lasers and food are regulated in the USA by the FDA AFAIK.

by fhub 3y ago

Do you eat any food made by corporations? Or grown by any corporations? Both lasers and food are regulated in the USA by the FDA AFAIK.

dylan604 3y ago

Your blind faith in "just because a product is available means it is safe" makes me wonder if you're familiar with the concept of a recall. Across all industries, companies have done something to the point that it is in the public's interest to remove that item from the market. There are so so many e.coli cases, listeria cases haunting the ice cream maker of my childhood to the point i never buy their brand now, and so many other food products that have been recalled for various reasons. I kind of wished I lived in your world that exists in your mind.

fhub 3y ago
I'm replying to the comment "I don't trust any corporation in any matter". But that is hard to do in practice. It would just take too much time for an individual to test every food they ever eat. Likewise I'm not going to take apart every product that is CE or CL certified to make sure it meets standards that I'm not even educated on. I don't have blind faith, I have some faith that trusting the certification processes in most matters is more cost effective for me than to verify everything myself. Especially for lasers that have strictly defined classes based on power output. That sort of trust does take on some risk. But I'm content with that level of risk. Things seem much safer now than they did when I was a kid.
- dylan604 3y ago
  Yes, because no decision made by any gov't body has ever "missed" something. In fact, recalls happen only because of the existence of these bodies. The FAA allowed Boeing to make the MAX series of planes. The CE and CL have certified products that have later been recalled. These agencies aren't perfect. The FDA has allowed things like Olestra. There are plenty of other examples. What's the difference between trusting any corp and trusting any agency? I'd say anyone trusting any corp/agency without any doubt would be somewhat delusional.
  - fhub 3y ago
    I think I understand what you are trying to say. You are saying that me saying "The LIDAR units used by these robot vacuums aren't powerful enough to damage cat/children's eyes. I trust that they wouldn't be on the market if they were." Equates to me trusting every corporation on every safety issue AND that I trust the certifications to be perfect AND I trust nothing ever gets missed. But all three of these is clearly (to me the author) not what I'm saying there. "The LIDAR units used by these robot vacuums aren't powerful enough to damage cat/children's eyes. I trust that they wouldn't be on the market if they were." My elaboration on this is that I trust that those lasers are of low enough power to not damage cat/children's eyes because consumer grade lasers are one of those things that I believe to be well regulated and certified before going on the market. I also happen to think that competitors would be tearing these things down at launch and if they found they were out of compliance they'd be very vocal about it. Then I go onto say "Do you eat any food made by corporations? Or grown by any corporations? Both lasers and food are regulated in the USA by the FDA AFAIK." specifically to someone saying "I don't trust any corporation on any matter". I just find that to be a hard position to take in any practical sense. Society only functions with some level of trust between supplier or consumer.
    - dylan604 3y ago
      your trust that things would not be on the market just seems very rose tinted glasses to me, but maybe my hesitancy in agreeing is slightly misplaced. rather than the blind trust, maybe it would be the "shocked to find out" something slipped past the regulations. we see this happen all the time. for me, the trust isn't there. i'm honestly shocked at this point that i don't get sick from mass produced food, or hurt by any other product. i just let the other animals in the herd go first more than trusting the regulators EDIT: here's a headline from just within the past hour recalling 50,000 cars with a "DO NOT DRIVE" warning[0]. that's from a very heavily regulated industry. these types of things are precisely why "trust" is not really warranted on my part. it's more of just blind acceptance, not trust. [0] https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/toyota-warns-50000-vehicle-owners-stop-driving-get-immediate-repairs-2024-01-29/ https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/toyota...