6 ms·

Besides the glaring absence of Claas Relotius, the article lists a number of high-profile journalistic fraud (one that briefly got a Pulitzer prize). It does no

Besides the glaring absence of Claas Relotius, the article lists a number of high-profile journalistic fraud (one that briefly got a Pulitzer prize). It does not go into detail but it does present a relatively fair assessment of how journalism goes back to being dubious, and that journalists as guardians of truth is actually not the historical pattern. It is very surface level on everything though. It does not go into details about what is below the apex of 'outright fabrication' in the journalistic fraud pyramid. Most journalists have always relied on either some extremely rich investor or Government funding and in both cases it is obvious they won't tolerate real independent journalism for their money.

jacquesm 3y ago
This is very much one of those things that the ridiculous right parrots in order to reduce trust in 'the media'. But the simple truth is that every profession, including journalism, has its rotten apples. But they're a small fraction of the total and in general journalists are the real thing.
- denton-scratch 3y ago
  > every profession, including journalism, has its rotten apples Referring to a professional person gone to the bad as a "rotten apple", meaning that most of the apples are fine, is a kind of malapropism. The full saying is: "One bad apple spoils the barrel". The claim is that corruption spreads if it is not opposed quickly and throughly. It's an error to use the phrase to minimise the scale or severity of wrongdoing.
  - slfnflctd 3y ago
    The usage of 'bad apple' which you are describing as incorrect is so widespread now that railing against it is futile. Language sometimes changes in ways we disagree with personally. I understand how you feel, I have the same feeling about how the word 'literally' is now defined as 'figuratively' in some dictionaries. Makes me want to tear my hair out... but the people have spoken.
    - mcphage 3y ago
      > I have the same feeling about how the word 'literally' is now defined as 'figuratively' in some dictionaries. Makes me want to tear my hair out... but the people have spoken. Usage of "literally" to mean "figuratively" dates back hundreds of years, with citations by top English writers. If you believed that "literally" meaning "figuratively" was a recent change, you were mistaken.
      - pessimizer 3y ago
        > Usage of "literally" to mean "figuratively" dates back hundreds of years, with citations by top English writers. Do you have a source for this? This is exactly how bullshit spreads. > If you believed that "literally" meaning "figuratively" was a recent change, you were mistaken. If you believe your authority as an anonymous commenter overrules the previous anonymous commenter, you have mistaken ideas about argumentation.
        mcphage 3y ago
        > Do you have a source for this? This is exactly how bullshit spreads. I did, just not on me—I had to come back with it. ** My daily bread is literally implored I have no barns nor granaries to hoard; — John Dryden, The Hind and The Panther (1687) Every day with me is literally another yesterday for it is exactly the same. — Alexander Pope, Letter to H. Cromwell (March 1708) His looks were very haggard, and his limbs and body literally worn to the bone — Charles Dickens, Nicholas Nickleby (1839) If we were not perfectly convinced that Hamlet's Father died before the play began, there would be nothing more remarkable in his taking a stroll at night, in an easterly wind, upon his own ramparts, than there would be in any other middle-aged gentleman rashly turning out after dark in a breezy spot -- say Saint Paul's Churchyard for instance -- literally to astonish his son's weak mind. — Charles Dickens, A Christmas Carol (1843) He is a fortunate man to be introduced to such a party of fine women at his arrival; it is literally to feed among the lilies. — Frances Brooke, The History of Emily Montague (1769) I look upon it, Madam, to be one of the luckiest circumstances of my life, that I have this moment the honour of receiving your commands, and the satisfaction of confirming with my tongue, what my eyes perhaps have but too weakly expressed — that I am literally the humblest of your servants. — George Colman and David Garrick, The Clandestine Marriage (1766) Lily, the caretaker's daughter, was literally run off her feet. — James Joyce, The Dead (1914) that he had shared her bedroom which came out in the witness box on oath when a thrill went through the packed court literally electrifying everybody in the shape of witnesses swearing to having witnessed him on such and such a particular date in the act of scrambling out of an upstairs apartment with the assistance of a ladder in night apparel... — James Joyce, Ulysses (1922) And when the middle of the afternoon came, from being a poor poverty-stricken boy in the morning, Tom was literally rolling in wealth. — Mark Twain, "The Adventure of Tom Sawyer" (1876) All colors made me happy: even gray. My eyes were such that literally they Took photographs. — Vladimir Nabokov, Pale Fire (1962) Literally, I was (what he often called me) the apple of his eye — Charlotte Bronte, Jane Eyre (1847)
- woolion 3y ago
  How come some professions are declared "high risk of fraud" by banks, insurance, accounting firms? Your statement implies that there is an obvious truth that fraud is equally distributed among professions. Nothing in reality subscribe to this blank statement. For something that's Atlas Obscura worthy, it's been a few centuries that people have been making ranking of fraud level by trade. There's a book, whose name I can't remember, that explained how much you should expect to be swindled by the baker, the windmill guy, etc. It explained some of the common tricks each profession would use, how widespread the tricks would be, and therefore do an estimate on the most dishonest professions.

jacquesm 3y ago

This is very much one of those things that the ridiculous right parrots in order to reduce trust in 'the media'. But the simple truth is that every profession, including journalism, has its rotten apples. But they're a small fraction of the total and in general journalists are the real thing.

denton-scratch 3y ago
> every profession, including journalism, has its rotten apples Referring to a professional person gone to the bad as a "rotten apple", meaning that most of the apples are fine, is a kind of malapropism. The full saying is: "One bad apple spoils the barrel". The claim is that corruption spreads if it is not opposed quickly and throughly. It's an error to use the phrase to minimise the scale or severity of wrongdoing.
- slfnflctd 3y ago
  The usage of 'bad apple' which you are describing as incorrect is so widespread now that railing against it is futile. Language sometimes changes in ways we disagree with personally. I understand how you feel, I have the same feeling about how the word 'literally' is now defined as 'figuratively' in some dictionaries. Makes me want to tear my hair out... but the people have spoken.
  - mcphage 3y ago
    > I have the same feeling about how the word 'literally' is now defined as 'figuratively' in some dictionaries. Makes me want to tear my hair out... but the people have spoken. Usage of "literally" to mean "figuratively" dates back hundreds of years, with citations by top English writers. If you believed that "literally" meaning "figuratively" was a recent change, you were mistaken.
    - pessimizer 3y ago
      > Usage of "literally" to mean "figuratively" dates back hundreds of years, with citations by top English writers. Do you have a source for this? This is exactly how bullshit spreads. > If you believed that "literally" meaning "figuratively" was a recent change, you were mistaken. If you believe your authority as an anonymous commenter overrules the previous anonymous commenter, you have mistaken ideas about argumentation.
      - mcphage 3y ago
        > Do you have a source for this? This is exactly how bullshit spreads. I did, just not on me—I had to come back with it. ** My daily bread is literally implored I have no barns nor granaries to hoard; — John Dryden, The Hind and The Panther (1687) Every day with me is literally another yesterday for it is exactly the same. — Alexander Pope, Letter to H. Cromwell (March 1708) His looks were very haggard, and his limbs and body literally worn to the bone — Charles Dickens, Nicholas Nickleby (1839) If we were not perfectly convinced that Hamlet's Father died before the play began, there would be nothing more remarkable in his taking a stroll at night, in an easterly wind, upon his own ramparts, than there would be in any other middle-aged gentleman rashly turning out after dark in a breezy spot -- say Saint Paul's Churchyard for instance -- literally to astonish his son's weak mind. — Charles Dickens, A Christmas Carol (1843) He is a fortunate man to be introduced to such a party of fine women at his arrival; it is literally to feed among the lilies. — Frances Brooke, The History of Emily Montague (1769) I look upon it, Madam, to be one of the luckiest circumstances of my life, that I have this moment the honour of receiving your commands, and the satisfaction of confirming with my tongue, what my eyes perhaps have but too weakly expressed — that I am literally the humblest of your servants. — George Colman and David Garrick, The Clandestine Marriage (1766) Lily, the caretaker's daughter, was literally run off her feet. — James Joyce, The Dead (1914) that he had shared her bedroom which came out in the witness box on oath when a thrill went through the packed court literally electrifying everybody in the shape of witnesses swearing to having witnessed him on such and such a particular date in the act of scrambling out of an upstairs apartment with the assistance of a ladder in night apparel... — James Joyce, Ulysses (1922) And when the middle of the afternoon came, from being a poor poverty-stricken boy in the morning, Tom was literally rolling in wealth. — Mark Twain, "The Adventure of Tom Sawyer" (1876) All colors made me happy: even gray. My eyes were such that literally they Took photographs. — Vladimir Nabokov, Pale Fire (1962) Literally, I was (what he often called me) the apple of his eye — Charlotte Bronte, Jane Eyre (1847)
woolion 3y ago
How come some professions are declared "high risk of fraud" by banks, insurance, accounting firms? Your statement implies that there is an obvious truth that fraud is equally distributed among professions. Nothing in reality subscribe to this blank statement. For something that's Atlas Obscura worthy, it's been a few centuries that people have been making ranking of fraud level by trade. There's a book, whose name I can't remember, that explained how much you should expect to be swindled by the baker, the windmill guy, etc. It explained some of the common tricks each profession would use, how widespread the tricks would be, and therefore do an estimate on the most dishonest professions.