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I never thought it was market with much room for disruption. There are so many competitors in this market catering to every niche possible. Where’s the ineffic

I never thought it was market with much room for disruption. There are so many competitors in this market catering to every niche possible. Where’s the inefficiencies? The market that needs disrupted is the new car market but that’s fraught with legal barriers that are not easily overcome.

CPLX 3y ago
The inefficiency is that buying a used car completely sucks from the buyer perspective. It really would be something if you could just like go buy a used car at a fixed fair price with literally zero hassle. Problem is it doesn’t seem like there’s any way to actually create that business and make any money.
- tylerrobinson 3y ago
  > It really would be something if you could just like go buy a used car at a fixed fair price with literally zero hassle. Is this not exactly what Carmax does, as said above?
- kube-system 3y ago
  Hassle is inherent to the used car market, because the product has inherently inconsistent and diminished quality, supply inherently mismatched with demand, etc. A good website or a clever business plan will never fix the problem that used cars cannot be manufactured. “No haggle” pricing is hardly a differentiator. Many traditional dealers in volume markets have done this for decades now. And buyers who really are willing to pay a premium to not haggle can simply pay sticker and choose to not haggle. Buyers who are frustrated with the used car experience and have the money to spend buy new cars. These disruptors are left fighting over some slice of buyers in the mid-market using the same limited sourcing ability thousands of other competitors suffer from.
- mmcgaha 3y ago
  It is funny that I always hear people want no haggle cars but no ever wants no haggle flea markets, or jewellery stores, or home buying. Why do folks have such a problem with cars?
  - kube-system 3y ago
    I don't think any of that is true. There are many people who have a social dislike for haggling for anything. There are many places that offer used merchandise for a fixed price that people shop at, flea markets are fairly unsuccessful in the market for used merchandise. There are many stores that sell jewelry at a fixed price. Stories about people groaning about bidding wars on homes are ubiquitous. And some sellers don't negotiate. Consumers are consumers, and some cross-section of them will always lack negotiation skills and/or have a distaste for the practice.
    - mmcgaha 3y ago
      What are you talking about? I did not say everyone likes to haggle. I did not say that haggle free places don't exist; in fact they even exist for cars. Sure people groan about bidding wars but who is asking for fixed price homes? I did not say anything about anyone's negotiation skills. Maybe I was a little too strong by saying no one complains since I have not discussed haggling with the entire population. Put simply, I hear people complain about car haggling but not haggling for other things. As far as you thinking not any of what I said is true; I think you read a whole lot more than I wrote.
      - kube-system 3y ago
        I am referring to your claim that “no ever wants no haggle flea markets, or jewellery stores, or home buying.” People often do want those things.
  - BobbyTables2 3y ago
    Imagine home buying if the seller silently added 5% in extra fees/features after the price was fixed… You do realize the “diamond paint protection” and the other 1000-$2000 of crap on a modest car is all fake — not even from the manufacturer. It’s just gravy after their commission is already baked in.
bombcar 3y ago
The inefficiency is now. I could sell my clunker for $5k if I waited a few weeks or so on Craigslist; with all the issues associated with selling used valuables. Or I could sell it to carmax for some amount less than they’ll get for it, and they can do an efficient cleanup pass and offer a warranty.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- kube-system 3y ago
  These “disruptors” (Vroom, Carvana) all have those same costs of buying vehicles, maintaining them, and marketing them. They haven’t disrupted any of those things.
  - _ea1k 3y ago
    TBH, I'm surprised that there aren't more efforts to organize a shift in that approach. Something like an agent model could potentially work really well here. Right now, this seems to only happen with specialty and classic cars, but I don't see why it couldn't work for any car. Just drop the car off and get a check when it sells, with their cut taken out. Then again, there might be issues aligning incentives.
    - bombcar 3y ago
      That’s just consignment sales, the problem is that most people selling a car need the cash now or quickly - often because they just bought a new one (hence selling it to the dealer for the down payment) or otherwise need to liquidate. If you have time to sell you can list and wait.
      - _ea1k 3y ago
        True, it won't work if they need the cash immediately. I think that's not always the case, though. There's a middle ground here where you can wait a bit, but really don't want to deal with Facebook Marketplace level buyers. I'm guessing this is why the space is growing so quickly with specialty vehicles.

CPLX 3y ago

The inefficiency is that buying a used car completely sucks from the buyer perspective. It really would be something if you could just like go buy a used car at a fixed fair price with literally zero hassle. Problem is it doesn’t seem like there’s any way to actually create that business and make any money.

tylerrobinson 3y ago
> It really would be something if you could just like go buy a used car at a fixed fair price with literally zero hassle. Is this not exactly what Carmax does, as said above?
kube-system 3y ago
Hassle is inherent to the used car market, because the product has inherently inconsistent and diminished quality, supply inherently mismatched with demand, etc. A good website or a clever business plan will never fix the problem that used cars cannot be manufactured. “No haggle” pricing is hardly a differentiator. Many traditional dealers in volume markets have done this for decades now. And buyers who really are willing to pay a premium to not haggle can simply pay sticker and choose to not haggle. Buyers who are frustrated with the used car experience and have the money to spend buy new cars. These disruptors are left fighting over some slice of buyers in the mid-market using the same limited sourcing ability thousands of other competitors suffer from.
mmcgaha 3y ago
It is funny that I always hear people want no haggle cars but no ever wants no haggle flea markets, or jewellery stores, or home buying. Why do folks have such a problem with cars?
- kube-system 3y ago
  I don't think any of that is true. There are many people who have a social dislike for haggling for anything. There are many places that offer used merchandise for a fixed price that people shop at, flea markets are fairly unsuccessful in the market for used merchandise. There are many stores that sell jewelry at a fixed price. Stories about people groaning about bidding wars on homes are ubiquitous. And some sellers don't negotiate. Consumers are consumers, and some cross-section of them will always lack negotiation skills and/or have a distaste for the practice.
  - mmcgaha 3y ago
    What are you talking about? I did not say everyone likes to haggle. I did not say that haggle free places don't exist; in fact they even exist for cars. Sure people groan about bidding wars but who is asking for fixed price homes? I did not say anything about anyone's negotiation skills. Maybe I was a little too strong by saying no one complains since I have not discussed haggling with the entire population. Put simply, I hear people complain about car haggling but not haggling for other things. As far as you thinking not any of what I said is true; I think you read a whole lot more than I wrote.
    - kube-system 3y ago
      I am referring to your claim that “no ever wants no haggle flea markets, or jewellery stores, or home buying.” People often do want those things.
- BobbyTables2 3y ago
  Imagine home buying if the seller silently added 5% in extra fees/features after the price was fixed… You do realize the “diamond paint protection” and the other 1000-$2000 of crap on a modest car is all fake — not even from the manufacturer. It’s just gravy after their commission is already baked in.

bombcar 3y ago

The inefficiency is now. I could sell my clunker for $5k if I waited a few weeks or so on Craigslist; with all the issues associated with selling used valuables. Or I could sell it to carmax for some amount less than they’ll get for it, and they can do an efficient cleanup pass and offer a warranty.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
kube-system 3y ago
These “disruptors” (Vroom, Carvana) all have those same costs of buying vehicles, maintaining them, and marketing them. They haven’t disrupted any of those things.
- _ea1k 3y ago
  TBH, I'm surprised that there aren't more efforts to organize a shift in that approach. Something like an agent model could potentially work really well here. Right now, this seems to only happen with specialty and classic cars, but I don't see why it couldn't work for any car. Just drop the car off and get a check when it sells, with their cut taken out. Then again, there might be issues aligning incentives.
  - bombcar 3y ago
    That’s just consignment sales, the problem is that most people selling a car need the cash now or quickly - often because they just bought a new one (hence selling it to the dealer for the down payment) or otherwise need to liquidate. If you have time to sell you can list and wait.
    - _ea1k 3y ago
      True, it won't work if they need the cash immediately. I think that's not always the case, though. There's a middle ground here where you can wait a bit, but really don't want to deal with Facebook Marketplace level buyers. I'm guessing this is why the space is growing so quickly with specialty vehicles.