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So if I develop a Catalyst app for an M1 powered Mac I can distribute it outside of the Mac App Store, and freely use Apple's SDK (as long as I pay the yearly 9

So if I develop a Catalyst app for an M1 powered Mac I can distribute it outside of the Mac App Store, and freely use Apple's SDK (as long as I pay the yearly 99 fee to enter their developer program). But if I distribute that exact same app on an M1 powered iPad outside of the App Store, I'll be subjected to a fee if my app goes viral, unless I agree not to profit from it and set up a non-profit organization?

AndrewKemendo 3y ago
I ran the calculator and basically anything over 1 million installs and you start to incur what is effectively a progressive tax
- RayVR 3y ago
  You are misunderstanding or misusing the word progressive here... If I have an app that makes $20,000 annually and all of the sudden there's a huge influx of new downloads (with no guarantee of converting to paid), then I am bankrupt. Apple will charge $4,500 to me PER MONTH for 100k downloads above 1 million. If I have 2 million downloads, I now owe Apple $45,000 per month. This means the new structure is incredibly regressive. This will destroy small businesses. I actually could not believe the fee calculator was correct, so I found the section in the terms[0] section 4.1 (A) lays out the fee, which is 0.5 EUR per app install above 1 million installs. This could, in theory, be used as a way for groups of people to target and take down small businesses. These downloads include "redownloads" where a user may delete and then download the application again. I can already see the lawsuits if Apple does not implement mitigations for these types of attacks. 0: https://developer.apple.com/contact/request/download/alternate_eu_terms_addendum.pdf https://developer.apple.com/contact/request/download/alterna...
  - AndrewKemendo 3y ago
    In fact I’m using it perfectly in line with how the term is used for taxes A progressive tax means you pay more the more the measure you use for taxation goes up A regressive tax means you pay more the more the measure you use for taxation goes down Regressive does not definitionally mean “bad for the small guy” even though that is a deterministic consequence of a regressive tax However the term progressive in this context is “value free” and simply an indication of the direction of relative increase in percentage given the increase or decrease in the taxable measure In this case the progression is a cliff so not very incremental
    - RayVR 3y ago
      So, if I understand what you are trying to say, it's a proportional tax. It is not progressive unless for some reason you view the "cliff" this way, though it is not a true cliff in the traditional tax sense, since exceeding does not remove the benefit of the 1m/year download credit. My argument that it is regressive is not based on it being "bad for the small guy", rather I was just pointing out that, as a regressive fee when looking at revenue/download, it will be very bad for small business.
  - pzo 3y ago
    this is also killing one time paid apps business model - next year if those users update app you will have to pay to apple even you didn't earn any new money from those users. You would be forced to change model to subscriptions to be sure you can stay afloat.
dimator 3y ago
> So if I develop a Catalyst app for an M1 powered Mac I can distribute it outside of the Mac App Store, and freely use Apple's SDK (as long as I pay the yearly 99 fee to enter their developer program). As far as Apple is concerned, this is a huge oversight, and will be rectified in the coming years. The idea of computing devices as uncontrollable platforms is a mistake to them. It's only a matter of time.

AndrewKemendo 3y ago

I ran the calculator and basically anything over 1 million installs and you start to incur what is effectively a progressive tax

RayVR 3y ago
You are misunderstanding or misusing the word progressive here... If I have an app that makes $20,000 annually and all of the sudden there's a huge influx of new downloads (with no guarantee of converting to paid), then I am bankrupt. Apple will charge $4,500 to me PER MONTH for 100k downloads above 1 million. If I have 2 million downloads, I now owe Apple $45,000 per month. This means the new structure is incredibly regressive. This will destroy small businesses. I actually could not believe the fee calculator was correct, so I found the section in the terms[0] section 4.1 (A) lays out the fee, which is 0.5 EUR per app install above 1 million installs. This could, in theory, be used as a way for groups of people to target and take down small businesses. These downloads include "redownloads" where a user may delete and then download the application again. I can already see the lawsuits if Apple does not implement mitigations for these types of attacks. 0: https://developer.apple.com/contact/request/download/alternate_eu_terms_addendum.pdf https://developer.apple.com/contact/request/download/alterna...
- AndrewKemendo 3y ago
  In fact I’m using it perfectly in line with how the term is used for taxes A progressive tax means you pay more the more the measure you use for taxation goes up A regressive tax means you pay more the more the measure you use for taxation goes down Regressive does not definitionally mean “bad for the small guy” even though that is a deterministic consequence of a regressive tax However the term progressive in this context is “value free” and simply an indication of the direction of relative increase in percentage given the increase or decrease in the taxable measure In this case the progression is a cliff so not very incremental
  - RayVR 3y ago
    So, if I understand what you are trying to say, it's a proportional tax. It is not progressive unless for some reason you view the "cliff" this way, though it is not a true cliff in the traditional tax sense, since exceeding does not remove the benefit of the 1m/year download credit. My argument that it is regressive is not based on it being "bad for the small guy", rather I was just pointing out that, as a regressive fee when looking at revenue/download, it will be very bad for small business.
- pzo 3y ago
  this is also killing one time paid apps business model - next year if those users update app you will have to pay to apple even you didn't earn any new money from those users. You would be forced to change model to subscriptions to be sure you can stay afloat.

dimator 3y ago

> So if I develop a Catalyst app for an M1 powered Mac I can distribute it outside of the Mac App Store, and freely use Apple's SDK (as long as I pay the yearly 99 fee to enter their developer program). As far as Apple is concerned, this is a huge oversight, and will be rectified in the coming years. The idea of computing devices as uncontrollable platforms is a mistake to them. It's only a matter of time.