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I contributed to the helicopter design for it so I'm biased but I think it'll happen eventually even if the funding isn't approved this administration/year/deca

I contributed to the helicopter design for it so I'm biased but I think it'll happen eventually even if the funding isn't approved this administration/year/decade. The already-stashed samples will be up there basically forever, and we'll probably want samples from a few different areas anyways, so it makes sense to go grab them.

ugh123 3y ago
I hope the development of the MAV will bring us closer to building launch vehicles capable of getting humans off Mars. Seems like the MAV is preloaded with fuel and pretty small but should provide some good data for future missions. https://mars.nasa.gov/msr/#Ascent-Vehicle https://mars.nasa.gov/msr/#Ascent-Vehicle
dcsommer 3y ago
Mars has weather, unlike the moon. Will the samples really still be there a decade or two from now?
- onepointsixC 3y ago
  The samples are meant to survive the vacuum of space but can't handle some weather? That seems unlikely.
  - robertlagrant 3y ago
    How erosive is the vacuum of space meant to be?
    - timschmidt 3y ago
      You mean that place that smells of burnt metal and is full of hard radiation? Surface of Mars is definitely more hospitable.
      - iancmceachern 3y ago
        Not less erosive though.
      - BuildTheRobots 3y ago
        > Overall, astronauts often compare the smell of space to "hot metal, burnt meat, burnt cakes, spent gunpowder and welding of metal," according to Steve Pearce, a biochemist and CEO of Omega Ingredients, who combed through astronaut interviews to help him craft a NASA-commissioned scent: https://www.livescience.com/space/what-does-space-smell-like https://www.livescience.com/space/what-does-space-smell-like Guess I'm one of today's 10,000.
        toomuchtodo 3y ago
        They made a perfume of it. https://eaudespace.com/ https://eaudespace.com/
        alfiopuglisi 3y ago
        Wouldn't it be the smell of space suits and space stations, rather than space itself? I don't think astronauts have tried to breath the few particles in the vacuum.
        timschmidt 3y ago
        The smell is apparent when one doffs their suit after a spacewalk.
- wharvle 3y ago
  Mars' famous dust storms aren't so good at causing damage, because the air's really, really thin, so they can't pick up heavy particles even with high wind speeds. A serious problem if you need to keep grit out of fine machinery or electronics, not so much if you're worried about erosion (I mean, yeah, eventually it'd be a problem, but it's slow-motion compared to the erosion of something exposed to sand storms on Earth) I guess it could eventually get buried, but I'd expect that to also be a slow process on most parts of the planet, for similar reasons. The only forces seriously driving weathering on the planet are radiation and wind—the radiation's pretty bad but not a problem for metal + some rocks that were already on the surface, at least over a span of a couple decades, and the wind just can't deliver much force because the atmosphere's so very thin (that's also why it's fairly difficult to fly on Mars).
  - somenameforme 3y ago
    As a fun anecdote this is one of the very few things that was completely faked in "The Martian" - book and movie alike, which is otherwise a hard sci-fi book. I think it's quite telling when your instigator for a disaster scenario on Mars has to be faked! Well at least intentionally faked. It turns out Martian regolith/soil is also much more moist than expected so getting water will be relatively easy, but at the time of the book this wasn't known!
    - generalizations 3y ago
      To be fair, it wasn't even the only disaster scenario in the movie - but it's very difficult to come up with a realistic scenario where someone would get left behind with a livable hab.
      - jenadine 3y ago
        How about a fight between members of the crew causing the mission to be cancelled, and one of the member left for dead after a violent interaction with another member who then lie about it.
    - omoikane 3y ago
- krisoft 3y ago
  We are talking about 6 inch long titanium tubes. What do you imagine the weather doing to them in a few decades?
- synapsomorphy 3y ago
  Yes, they will. The weather on Mars can't do much to metal tubes. They probably won't be buried either (the area they're in doesn't get much net deposition, you can tell from how rocky it is), but if that does happen, each sample's position and the terrain around them is very precisely mapped so it would be extremely unlikely that any get completely lost. https://mars.nasa.gov/news/9337/nasas-perseverance-rover-completes-mars-sample-depot/ https://mars.nasa.gov/news/9337/nasas-perseverance-rover-com...
- inamberclad 3y ago
  I'd wager yes since Mars has less extreme thermal cycles than the moon
- admissionsguy 3y ago
  I would expect muskonauts will make the samples redundant by then.

ugh123 3y ago

I hope the development of the MAV will bring us closer to building launch vehicles capable of getting humans off Mars. Seems like the MAV is preloaded with fuel and pretty small but should provide some good data for future missions. https://mars.nasa.gov/msr/#Ascent-Vehicle https://mars.nasa.gov/msr/#Ascent-Vehicle

dcsommer 3y ago

Mars has weather, unlike the moon. Will the samples really still be there a decade or two from now?

onepointsixC 3y ago
The samples are meant to survive the vacuum of space but can't handle some weather? That seems unlikely.
- robertlagrant 3y ago
  How erosive is the vacuum of space meant to be?
  - timschmidt 3y ago
    You mean that place that smells of burnt metal and is full of hard radiation? Surface of Mars is definitely more hospitable.
    - iancmceachern 3y ago
      Not less erosive though.
    - BuildTheRobots 3y ago
      > Overall, astronauts often compare the smell of space to "hot metal, burnt meat, burnt cakes, spent gunpowder and welding of metal," according to Steve Pearce, a biochemist and CEO of Omega Ingredients, who combed through astronaut interviews to help him craft a NASA-commissioned scent: https://www.livescience.com/space/what-does-space-smell-like https://www.livescience.com/space/what-does-space-smell-like Guess I'm one of today's 10,000.
      - toomuchtodo 3y ago
        They made a perfume of it. https://eaudespace.com/ https://eaudespace.com/
      - alfiopuglisi 3y ago
        Wouldn't it be the smell of space suits and space stations, rather than space itself? I don't think astronauts have tried to breath the few particles in the vacuum.
        timschmidt 3y ago
        The smell is apparent when one doffs their suit after a spacewalk.
wharvle 3y ago
Mars' famous dust storms aren't so good at causing damage, because the air's really, really thin, so they can't pick up heavy particles even with high wind speeds. A serious problem if you need to keep grit out of fine machinery or electronics, not so much if you're worried about erosion (I mean, yeah, eventually it'd be a problem, but it's slow-motion compared to the erosion of something exposed to sand storms on Earth) I guess it could eventually get buried, but I'd expect that to also be a slow process on most parts of the planet, for similar reasons. The only forces seriously driving weathering on the planet are radiation and wind—the radiation's pretty bad but not a problem for metal + some rocks that were already on the surface, at least over a span of a couple decades, and the wind just can't deliver much force because the atmosphere's so very thin (that's also why it's fairly difficult to fly on Mars).
- somenameforme 3y ago
  As a fun anecdote this is one of the very few things that was completely faked in "The Martian" - book and movie alike, which is otherwise a hard sci-fi book. I think it's quite telling when your instigator for a disaster scenario on Mars has to be faked! Well at least intentionally faked. It turns out Martian regolith/soil is also much more moist than expected so getting water will be relatively easy, but at the time of the book this wasn't known!
  - generalizations 3y ago
    To be fair, it wasn't even the only disaster scenario in the movie - but it's very difficult to come up with a realistic scenario where someone would get left behind with a livable hab.
    - jenadine 3y ago
      How about a fight between members of the crew causing the mission to be cancelled, and one of the member left for dead after a violent interaction with another member who then lie about it.
  - omoikane 3y ago
krisoft 3y ago
We are talking about 6 inch long titanium tubes. What do you imagine the weather doing to them in a few decades?
synapsomorphy 3y ago
Yes, they will. The weather on Mars can't do much to metal tubes. They probably won't be buried either (the area they're in doesn't get much net deposition, you can tell from how rocky it is), but if that does happen, each sample's position and the terrain around them is very precisely mapped so it would be extremely unlikely that any get completely lost. https://mars.nasa.gov/news/9337/nasas-perseverance-rover-completes-mars-sample-depot/ https://mars.nasa.gov/news/9337/nasas-perseverance-rover-com...
inamberclad 3y ago
I'd wager yes since Mars has less extreme thermal cycles than the moon
admissionsguy 3y ago
I would expect muskonauts will make the samples redundant by then.