4 ms·

This is good. An app that can't survive without stealing your private data isn't worthy to be on the European market.

switch007 3y ago
You’re happy with only large tech giants existing then. Because lots of regulations are just barriers to entry and allow the existing players to keep playing
- asow92 3y ago
  [flagged]
- hnlmorg 3y ago
  The problem is the same argument also works in reverse: few regulations just make it easier for larger players to block smaller players from operating via dishonest business practices. Ultimately existing players always have the advantage. As a side note: the startup world is thriving in Europe. So EU regulations can’t be that high of a barrier ;)
  - asow92 3y ago
    Personally, I don't think this works in real life. Consumers catch on to dishonest business practices and want choose new market options if/when they becomes available, and do not need a nanny state to pick winners and losers. If anything, excessive regulation and legal hurdles impede and prevent this market force from working as it should. Internet providers in the US are a perfect example of this in action: why would these virtual monopolies want to provide a better product if it's so hard for competition to materialize? They are incentivized to offer a less than ideal product while also lobbying for increased or maintained regulation to ensure the status quo. This isn't capitalism, but cronyism. Also, which startups are thriving in Europe with global appeal? Genuinely, un-sarcastically, curious.
    - hnlmorg 3y ago
      > Consumers catch on to dishonest business practices and want choose new market options if/when they becomes available, That almost never happens > Internet providers in the US are a perfect example of this in action: why would these virtual monopolies want to provide a better product if it's so hard for competition to materialize? Infrastructure costs is why you don’t see hundreds of competitors. New companies either need the capital to build new infrastructure, in which case they are usually more expensive due to economies of scale, or they have to resell someone else’s infrastructure. In which case they can only be as good as the monopolies. The ironic thing is in the UK there aren’t any monopolies in ISP. There is lots of healthy competition. So your example regarding deregulation proves the opposite of your point.
      - asow92 3y ago
        > That almost never happens I beg to differ. https://appleinsider.com/articles/23/08/28/undercharged-iphone-14-owners-complain-about-lower-battery-endurance https://appleinsider.com/articles/23/08/28/undercharged-ipho... https://www.reddit.com/r/Spectrum/comments/ln0id2/spectrum_lies_violations_and_fraud/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Spectrum/comments/ln0id2/spectrum_l... https://www.thisoldhouse.com/home-finances/reviews/worst-home-warranty-companies https://www.thisoldhouse.com/home-finances/reviews/worst-hom... https://www.theverge.com/2023/3/13/23637401/samsung-fake-moon-photos-ai-galaxy-s21-s23-ultra https://www.theverge.com/2023/3/13/23637401/samsung-fake-moo... https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2018/02/01/bad-reputation-americas-top-20-most-hated-companies/1058718001/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2018/02/01/bad...
        hnlmorg 3y ago
        They just prove my point. Take the last link, for example, United Airlines scores low in customer satisfaction yet people still fly with them. Facebook might be hated yet people still use it. Most people either too lazy or too cheap to boycott businesses they don’t like. And that’s assuming they even have a choice, because often there really isn’t much of an alternative to choose from.
asow92 3y ago
It's not like these companies are trying to steal your private data. They just don't see working through legal compliance as worth the squeeze — especially when they are young and don't have the resources to comply properly. edit: > worthy of the European market. Also, what an entitled, elitist thing to say. Maybe the US would be better off pulling out of Nato and letting Europe alone after all.
- cynicalsecurity 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - asow92 3y ago
    It’s okay, I forgive you.
throw10920 3y ago
I think you responded to the wrong comment by accident, because nowhere did the parent user say that the companies they worked with were trying to take users' data, or had trouble with privacy-related EU law. Don't forget to double-check to make sure you're responding to the right comment!

You’re happy with only large tech giants existing then. Because lots of regulations are just barriers to entry and allow the existing players to keep playing

asow92 3y ago
[flagged]
hnlmorg 3y ago
The problem is the same argument also works in reverse: few regulations just make it easier for larger players to block smaller players from operating via dishonest business practices. Ultimately existing players always have the advantage. As a side note: the startup world is thriving in Europe. So EU regulations can’t be that high of a barrier ;)
- asow92 3y ago
  Personally, I don't think this works in real life. Consumers catch on to dishonest business practices and want choose new market options if/when they becomes available, and do not need a nanny state to pick winners and losers. If anything, excessive regulation and legal hurdles impede and prevent this market force from working as it should. Internet providers in the US are a perfect example of this in action: why would these virtual monopolies want to provide a better product if it's so hard for competition to materialize? They are incentivized to offer a less than ideal product while also lobbying for increased or maintained regulation to ensure the status quo. This isn't capitalism, but cronyism. Also, which startups are thriving in Europe with global appeal? Genuinely, un-sarcastically, curious.
  - hnlmorg 3y ago
    > Consumers catch on to dishonest business practices and want choose new market options if/when they becomes available, That almost never happens > Internet providers in the US are a perfect example of this in action: why would these virtual monopolies want to provide a better product if it's so hard for competition to materialize? Infrastructure costs is why you don’t see hundreds of competitors. New companies either need the capital to build new infrastructure, in which case they are usually more expensive due to economies of scale, or they have to resell someone else’s infrastructure. In which case they can only be as good as the monopolies. The ironic thing is in the UK there aren’t any monopolies in ISP. There is lots of healthy competition. So your example regarding deregulation proves the opposite of your point.
    - asow92 3y ago
      > That almost never happens I beg to differ. https://appleinsider.com/articles/23/08/28/undercharged-iphone-14-owners-complain-about-lower-battery-endurance https://appleinsider.com/articles/23/08/28/undercharged-ipho... https://www.reddit.com/r/Spectrum/comments/ln0id2/spectrum_lies_violations_and_fraud/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Spectrum/comments/ln0id2/spectrum_l... https://www.thisoldhouse.com/home-finances/reviews/worst-home-warranty-companies https://www.thisoldhouse.com/home-finances/reviews/worst-hom... https://www.theverge.com/2023/3/13/23637401/samsung-fake-moon-photos-ai-galaxy-s21-s23-ultra https://www.theverge.com/2023/3/13/23637401/samsung-fake-moo... https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2018/02/01/bad-reputation-americas-top-20-most-hated-companies/1058718001/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2018/02/01/bad...
      - hnlmorg 3y ago
        They just prove my point. Take the last link, for example, United Airlines scores low in customer satisfaction yet people still fly with them. Facebook might be hated yet people still use it. Most people either too lazy or too cheap to boycott businesses they don’t like. And that’s assuming they even have a choice, because often there really isn’t much of an alternative to choose from.

asow92 3y ago

It's not like these companies are trying to steal your private data. They just don't see working through legal compliance as worth the squeeze — especially when they are young and don't have the resources to comply properly. edit: > worthy of the European market. Also, what an entitled, elitist thing to say. Maybe the US would be better off pulling out of Nato and letting Europe alone after all.

cynicalsecurity 3y ago
[flagged]
- asow92 3y ago
  It’s okay, I forgive you.

throw10920 3y ago

I think you responded to the wrong comment by accident, because nowhere did the parent user say that the companies they worked with were trying to take users' data, or had trouble with privacy-related EU law. Don't forget to double-check to make sure you're responding to the right comment!