6 ms·

Can autoimmune diseases be cured? Scientists see hope at last

221 points by gumby 3y ago

jbm 3y ago
My first thought was whether this could help with allergies; this seems to be a much, much bigger group of people. Sadly it didn't seem to come up in the article. Oh and yay University of Calgary!
- kelnos 3y ago
  It seems like one of the approaches they are looking into is very similar to an existing treatment for allergies, at least on the surface: > In some cases, that means administering the very antigens that the rogue cells are trained to attack, a strategy that can deprogram the cells and dampen the autoimmune response. I go to my allergist every month to get three shots under my skin, which are cocktails of concentrated versions of the various things I'm allergic to. It's been almost 3.5 years since I started, and while my allergies are certainly better than they used to be, they're far from "cured". I don't really expect further improvement; I'm supposed to do another year and a half in order to increase the chances of it "sticking" for longer. But even then, some patients report their allergies come back in full force in anywhere between 5 and 20 years. But they are also looking into: > Other researchers are trying to selectively wipe out the problematic cells, or to introduce suppressive immune cells that have been engineered to target them. ... which I personally think is much more promising, if possibly much more difficult to accomplish.
mieubrisse 3y ago
Fascinating and informative article. I'm wrestling with an unknown something that looks like it might be autoimmune, and this reads like the difference between "you're destined to a lifetime of palliative treatments" vs "there might be a something you can do to actually cure yourself". And I don't even have anything confirmed; I can't imagine what folks who actually have a confirmed autoimmune disorder must be feeling.
- josefresco 3y ago
  I'm 6ish years into my RA diagnosis. The first 2 years were very rough both physically but more so mentally. I manage the mental aspect better now, and my symptoms have stabilized which certainly helps the former. However it's easy to dip into despair when you know what the long term prospects are for life quality and expectancy.
- EasyMark 3y ago
  The biggest thing that helped me was diet (avoiding suspected inflammatory foods and drink). The diet that worked for me was very low carb (I keep it under 30g a day). Also, always getting sleep, no matter what 8-9 hours a night. I only eat in an 8 hour window each day (11-7pm). I only eat food that isn't processed to avoid artificial ingredients and possible triggers). For about a year I was seeing doctors and barely getting any work done, I was on crutches most of the time because it hit my knees particularly bad but it was a full body condition with swollen joints and lethargy. I tried several drugs, prednisone was the only one that made the slightest difference, but basically completely robbed me of the ability to focus on anything complex. Switching up diet and getting rest was what seemingly did it. After about a month of that most symptoms gone, after 3 all symptoms gone. It could have been strictly coincidence, but I dropped a bunch of weight and haven't had a recurrence since that happened. I got used to the diet limitations, but it took a while. It's been 6 years of no issues. Some things thrown at me by docs, "it was an unknown virus we couldn't find in your blood samples", "it was a food allergy, your radical diet cut out or greatly reduced whatever it was", "It's just in remission", but I'll keep doing what I'm doing since in general it got me back to my fighting weight, I have plenty energy, all my blood work and physicals show I'm in great health, so it is what it is.
  - mieubrisse 3y ago
    This sleep thing is so intriguing. I've treated sleep as somewhat optional - try to get 8h... but if I don't, I'll make it up later at $unspecified_date. Unsurprisingly, my Fitbit registered that, for 2023, I got 6.5h of average sleep per night. Your post suggests that making 8-9 hours per night mandatory might do some good; I'm going to give this a go. Thanks!
parrellel 3y ago
Type 1 and RA in the family here and they are life re-defining conditions. Everyone of us is watching this research like a hawk.
- josefresco 3y ago
  Same here, I have RA, my dad had RA (remission now) and I have two sisters with still mysterious auto-immune disorders. This news and all news on treatments that aren't blunt immune response hammers gives us hope. Tip for those watching prescription TC commercials: When they say "you may be more prone to infection" take it very, very seriously.
  - hirvi74 3y ago
    > When they say "you may be more prone to infection" take it very, very seriously. I suppose it depends on the disease. I have read rather conflicting research about whether certain DMARDs/Biologics actually increase cancer rates, infections, etc.. I'm about the furthest thing from a expert one can be in regards to this topic, but I will say that I have always purposely tried to stay away from those medications "just in case." I am also in a fortunate enough situation that I am not required to go on such medications despite having the option in order to live a mostly normal life. I'm not some "big pharma bad" person, but something about those medications have never sat well with me. I suppose for many, the risk of the cure outweighs the risk of the disease. But in regards to something as integral as the human immune system, I real do not want to "fuck around & find out" as people say these days. Until there is a legitimate cure or safer medicines, I suppose I am (dis)content with the level of disease activity I currently have.
    - parrellel 3y ago
      This is great if your particular immune disorder doesn't kill your ability to walk or eat or type, but the increased cancer risk definitely seems worth not having to comparison shop foot-pedal mice. I've read that the increased cancer risk isn't so much an increase in cancer rate as a reduction in bodily policing of early cancers?
voisin 3y ago
What’s the best way to track research, RSS-style, rather than manually doing searches and hoping you see follow ups?
- fabian2k 3y ago
  Pubmed is the database you'd typically want to look at for medical and natural sciences. You can configure email alerts for specific keywords there, though it's been ages that I've done that.
  - wcarss 3y ago
    This is the specific kind of thing I want to use LLMs for. I want to describe "what I'm looking for" to an LLM and have it go out each week and digest the most recent 100 papers, and occasionally pop up to tell me when there's something potentially relevant to read.
  - sydd 3y ago
    While you could do that it would just give you false hope. Pubmed contains research from all areas of natural sciences, and you need to get used to the wording to know feasible the claims of an article are. Some examples: - Usually research goes in vitro (in a petri dish) -> in animals -> in humans. An article can claim that they've found the cure for cancer, if its just in vitro it doesnt mean much. The medicine needs to go to the right place, it should not have too bad side effects,...a very small percentage of medicine that works in vitro makes it to human testing. - even if it works in humans it might not be feasible to manufacture it. We have got medicine that costs over 3 million USD per dose, obviously there is a cost when the manufacturer just scraps the project even if it works perfectly.
  - voisin 3y ago
    Thank you! I didn’t realize Pubmed had these options. I just found that it has “Create an RSS feed” of any search ter, which is fantastic. Thanks for the pointer!
kelnos 3y ago
Absolute layperson here, but: > In some cases, that means administering the very antigens that the rogue cells are trained to attack, a strategy that can deprogram the cells and dampen the autoimmune response. This sounds exactly like the strategy my allergy doc uses to suppress my allergies. Regularly expose my immune system to concentrated amounts of the allergens in order to deprogram the immune system's erroneous response. If it really is similar and analogous, I'm not really holding out much hope for this. Results from allergy shots seem to be all over the map. Yes, definitely positive results on average, that make it worth it for many people (myself included), but if it is indeed similar, I don't think this can be a general solution to these autoimmune diseases, that will work for everyone, or even most people. (Notably, the practice I go to is an "Immunology & Allergy" practice.) > Other researchers are trying to selectively wipe out the problematic cells, or to introduce suppressive immune cells that have been engineered to target them. This seems much more promising? Probably much more difficult, though, which I think makes the "deprogramming" method above worthwhile to look into, since it could potentially work well enough, for enough people, to make it worth the effort. Again, complete layperson here. If the immune system's response when it comes to allergies is nothing like the mechanisms in play when we're talking about autoimmune disorders, then... well, never mind, I guess.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- mattmaroon 3y ago
  I think the biggest healthcare change of the next 50 years is going to be customized medicine. Instead of jamming a one-size-fits-all chemical into a pill or shot and just hoping it's good for everyone with a given problem, it'll be more like 3d printing. MRNA already is very much like that, though it's still in its infancy.
- m3kw9 3y ago
  You can say anything but I just let them go thru phase 3 first before talking
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
nullserver 3y ago
Sjögrens. Which is similar to Lupus. Diet changes can make a huge difference. Earlier the better. On many support forums I see a pattern of people using the various meds with mixed results. Then people starting to experiment with which foods they seem to do better with. Then discovering the auto immune protocol diet. A lot of people don’t wanna go to the effort, so won’t try it and complain about it. People that try it and actually follow it often have amazing results, and all their symptoms calm down. A lot of people just cannot give up the pizza and chips though.
- hirvi74 3y ago
  My issue with the dietary suggestions is that I have yet to see enough conclusive evidence that any of them work (especially long-term). I feel like much of the information is just a Survivorship Bias. Who blogs about the countless diets that failed to help them? My understanding is that even for those who receive positive results, such results are highly anecdotal and individually specific. One person goes vegan and is cured. Another goes on a strictly carnivore diet and is cured. Same can be said for Mediterranean Diet, Plant-based, keto, etc.. So, which one should be recommended? How many should one try before they give up? How long should they try before they give up? "Nightshades cause inflammation." How? Why? At what dosage -- one slick of bell pepper can't be equal to five pounds of tomatoes, right? Why is this an issue only in some people? I am not trying to dismiss the premise because there could be validity to dietary factors impacting disease prognosis, but part of me also wants to believe that if the treatments were as simple as dietary interventions, then a majority of people with AI diseases would be cured already. I refuse to accept the conspiracy that diets hold the hidden cure for a majority of AI diseases, and that Big Pharma and doctors wouldn't profit as much if people made dietary interventions, so that's why they keep people sick with AI diseases by only treating the symptoms. Accepting such would be ignoring that there is also an entire "Big Diet" industry that stands to make a profit off the same desperate people. All I am gonna say is that, Dr. Jonas Salk invented the first effective Polio vaccine, did not patent his findings, an thus released it for free so the world could be a better place. Dr. John Pagano apparently discovered a diet that helps treat/cure AI diseases. You can learn more about it for $64.22 on Amazon.
  - 3y ago
ahstilde 3y ago
Technically, allergies are an autoimmune disease, and they're certainly effectively curable through a change in the immune response. We're increasing the availability of allergy immunotherapy with our company, Wyndly. https://www.wyndly.com/pages/immunotherapy https://www.wyndly.com/pages/immunotherapy I'd love to see this for more conditions.
- anonymouskimmer 3y ago
  Is it medically possible to make a combination sublingual drop for a variety of common allergies without side-effects? $250 for a test and then whatever payments to have a doctor prescribe it is out of reach for many. A single over-the-counter for the more common allergies, or even regional over-the-counters for regional allergens, would be reach a lot more people. For the serious allergic reactions I can see why a personalized plan would be required. But for the more mild reactions this seems hypothetically possible. Aside: If wondered for a bit whether something like honey blends of many regional honeys for young children older than 6 months would eliminate most of the seasonal pollen allergies that people develop from moving to other parts of the country/world. Edit to add: I believe you're wrong about the "technically" part. Allergies aren't attacking the body (therefore not "auto"), merely causing symptoms through the general immune response against the allergen. This is particularly aggravating to an individual because the immune response is long lasting, as it's impossible for the immune system to eliminate the foreign antigen when said antigen is prevalent in the environment.
  - aitchnyu 3y ago
    I doubt it can be OTC. My sublingual immunotherapy was started in doctors office to monitor adverse symptoms and there was a dose ramp up over 4 weeks.
- Metacelsus 3y ago
  >Technically, allergies are an autoimmune disease No, autoimmune means an immune reaction against a human protein (which allergens are not).
  - 3y ago
hirvi74 3y ago
I am not trying to be a downer, and I am a person who would greatly benefit from this type of cure having one autoimmune disorder myself. However, I'll just say that I will believe it when I see it. Until this is lumped in with the other innovations that a mere carrots on a stick like a cure for cancer, material that can replace plastic without compromise, flying cars, ability to regrow enamel/reverse dental caries, etc..
notamy 3y ago
This would be lovely if it pans out. I’ve been grappling with a neurological issue for a while now that might be autoimmune (testing inconclusive so far); fortunately the neurological symptoms are reversible, but having an autoimmune variant of this issue would be life-altering with how treatment progresses.
eaurouge 3y ago
> But what’s most surprising is that they have all stayed in remission, even after they began producing new B cells. It’s as if wiping out the B cells performed a reset on the immune system. Apparently repeated cycles of prolonged fasts can also trigger apoptosis and reset the immune system. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7474734/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7474734/
epgui 3y ago
Very interesting, and indeed promising, but IMO over-optimistic in the way the approach is presented.
jph 3y ago
Mast cells, histamines, allergies, and sensitivities are autoimmune areas that affect many millions of people, and intertwine with many medical conditions. If you're seeking information about these, especially real-world ways to help such as diet, fasting, nutrition, neural retraining, complementary and alternative medicine, and the like, here are my notes in progress with a bunch of chatGPT glossary pages. Feedback welcome. https://mastcell.help https://mastcell.help
- drc500free 3y ago
  Thanks for the resource, how have you found working with chatGPT for this sort of thing? If you have some sort of mast cell disease, did you happen to get the covid vaccine? Any issues?
  - jph 3y ago
    ChatGPT is great. It's training me in all these topics, as fast as I can search and learn. It's helping me to talk with doctors and experts. It's helping me share what I'm learning with many more people on various patient groups. Yes I got the covid vaccine and boosters, and also flu, shingles, TDAP, etc. No issues. Are you aware that there's research that overlaps COVID and mast cell issues? For example: famotidine antihistamine activates the vagus nerve inflammatory reflex to attenuate cytokine storms. For me personally, I don't yet know my root cause. I'm ramping up on medical research papers, and trying a hundred or so kinds of treatments to see what helps.
    - drc500free 3y ago
      Didn't know that about famotidine, that's very interesting. My wife has HaT (she was in the NIH study) and MCAS, and got absolutely wiped out by her reaction to the first vaccine. One of her specialists told her she's seen that happen with a few other HaT patients. We've been considering everything ranging from hard science to total woo, with what's worked best documented here: https://edsetc.com/ https://edsetc.com/
      - 3y ago
m3kw9 3y ago
Maybe we are on our way out of medival style medicine and actually get a cure and stead of attacking it with ball and chain style therapies
- JoyfulTurkey 3y ago
  Cue Star Trek IV hospital scene with Bones.
supertofu 3y ago
Gosh, I hope so. I have UC (ulcerative colitis), and my quality of life can vary wildly depending on flare-ups. It's a pretty brutal condition, and a horrible way to live if the disease isn't well-managed by meds or other therapies.
- JR1427 3y ago
  Sorry to hear that your UC is hard to live with. I was diagnosed nearly 4 years ago during my first flare, after I had a COVID-like illness. I've been taking mesalazine ever since, and am grateful every day for another day without symptoms. I take mesalazine tablets daily, and mesalazine enema twice a week. (The latter is really not a big deal, once you've got used to it, and is apparently very effective at preventing flares. I started off doing them every day, and very slowly over the two years reduced to twice per week, which I can tolerate.) I think I'll continue taking medication indefinitely, as for me it is not worth the risk coming off it.
  - felixg3 3y ago
    Another fellow UCer! I‘m on Upadacitinib (Rinvoq) after many failed medications now. So glad to hear you’re fine with enemas. They worked a long time for me, too.:)
  - supertofu 3y ago
    I'm glad mesalamine is working for you. I failed mesalamine and moved on to Humira. The Humira gives me quality of life, but I still have mini-flares when sick, and I still have bleeding. I wish I could be off meds, but without the Humira I lose all function. It's horrifying.

221 points by gumby 3y ago

jbm 3y ago

My first thought was whether this could help with allergies; this seems to be a much, much bigger group of people. Sadly it didn't seem to come up in the article. Oh and yay University of Calgary!

kelnos 3y ago
It seems like one of the approaches they are looking into is very similar to an existing treatment for allergies, at least on the surface: > In some cases, that means administering the very antigens that the rogue cells are trained to attack, a strategy that can deprogram the cells and dampen the autoimmune response. I go to my allergist every month to get three shots under my skin, which are cocktails of concentrated versions of the various things I'm allergic to. It's been almost 3.5 years since I started, and while my allergies are certainly better than they used to be, they're far from "cured". I don't really expect further improvement; I'm supposed to do another year and a half in order to increase the chances of it "sticking" for longer. But even then, some patients report their allergies come back in full force in anywhere between 5 and 20 years. But they are also looking into: > Other researchers are trying to selectively wipe out the problematic cells, or to introduce suppressive immune cells that have been engineered to target them. ... which I personally think is much more promising, if possibly much more difficult to accomplish.

mieubrisse 3y ago

Fascinating and informative article. I'm wrestling with an unknown something that looks like it might be autoimmune, and this reads like the difference between "you're destined to a lifetime of palliative treatments" vs "there might be a something you can do to actually cure yourself". And I don't even have anything confirmed; I can't imagine what folks who actually have a confirmed autoimmune disorder must be feeling.

josefresco 3y ago
I'm 6ish years into my RA diagnosis. The first 2 years were very rough both physically but more so mentally. I manage the mental aspect better now, and my symptoms have stabilized which certainly helps the former. However it's easy to dip into despair when you know what the long term prospects are for life quality and expectancy.
EasyMark 3y ago
The biggest thing that helped me was diet (avoiding suspected inflammatory foods and drink). The diet that worked for me was very low carb (I keep it under 30g a day). Also, always getting sleep, no matter what 8-9 hours a night. I only eat in an 8 hour window each day (11-7pm). I only eat food that isn't processed to avoid artificial ingredients and possible triggers). For about a year I was seeing doctors and barely getting any work done, I was on crutches most of the time because it hit my knees particularly bad but it was a full body condition with swollen joints and lethargy. I tried several drugs, prednisone was the only one that made the slightest difference, but basically completely robbed me of the ability to focus on anything complex. Switching up diet and getting rest was what seemingly did it. After about a month of that most symptoms gone, after 3 all symptoms gone. It could have been strictly coincidence, but I dropped a bunch of weight and haven't had a recurrence since that happened. I got used to the diet limitations, but it took a while. It's been 6 years of no issues. Some things thrown at me by docs, "it was an unknown virus we couldn't find in your blood samples", "it was a food allergy, your radical diet cut out or greatly reduced whatever it was", "It's just in remission", but I'll keep doing what I'm doing since in general it got me back to my fighting weight, I have plenty energy, all my blood work and physicals show I'm in great health, so it is what it is.
- mieubrisse 3y ago
  This sleep thing is so intriguing. I've treated sleep as somewhat optional - try to get 8h... but if I don't, I'll make it up later at $unspecified_date. Unsurprisingly, my Fitbit registered that, for 2023, I got 6.5h of average sleep per night. Your post suggests that making 8-9 hours per night mandatory might do some good; I'm going to give this a go. Thanks!

parrellel 3y ago

Type 1 and RA in the family here and they are life re-defining conditions. Everyone of us is watching this research like a hawk.

josefresco 3y ago
Same here, I have RA, my dad had RA (remission now) and I have two sisters with still mysterious auto-immune disorders. This news and all news on treatments that aren't blunt immune response hammers gives us hope. Tip for those watching prescription TC commercials: When they say "you may be more prone to infection" take it very, very seriously.
- hirvi74 3y ago
  > When they say "you may be more prone to infection" take it very, very seriously. I suppose it depends on the disease. I have read rather conflicting research about whether certain DMARDs/Biologics actually increase cancer rates, infections, etc.. I'm about the furthest thing from a expert one can be in regards to this topic, but I will say that I have always purposely tried to stay away from those medications "just in case." I am also in a fortunate enough situation that I am not required to go on such medications despite having the option in order to live a mostly normal life. I'm not some "big pharma bad" person, but something about those medications have never sat well with me. I suppose for many, the risk of the cure outweighs the risk of the disease. But in regards to something as integral as the human immune system, I real do not want to "fuck around & find out" as people say these days. Until there is a legitimate cure or safer medicines, I suppose I am (dis)content with the level of disease activity I currently have.
  - parrellel 3y ago
    This is great if your particular immune disorder doesn't kill your ability to walk or eat or type, but the increased cancer risk definitely seems worth not having to comparison shop foot-pedal mice. I've read that the increased cancer risk isn't so much an increase in cancer rate as a reduction in bodily policing of early cancers?

voisin 3y ago

What’s the best way to track research, RSS-style, rather than manually doing searches and hoping you see follow ups?

fabian2k 3y ago
Pubmed is the database you'd typically want to look at for medical and natural sciences. You can configure email alerts for specific keywords there, though it's been ages that I've done that.
- wcarss 3y ago
  This is the specific kind of thing I want to use LLMs for. I want to describe "what I'm looking for" to an LLM and have it go out each week and digest the most recent 100 papers, and occasionally pop up to tell me when there's something potentially relevant to read.
- sydd 3y ago
  While you could do that it would just give you false hope. Pubmed contains research from all areas of natural sciences, and you need to get used to the wording to know feasible the claims of an article are. Some examples: - Usually research goes in vitro (in a petri dish) -> in animals -> in humans. An article can claim that they've found the cure for cancer, if its just in vitro it doesnt mean much. The medicine needs to go to the right place, it should not have too bad side effects,...a very small percentage of medicine that works in vitro makes it to human testing. - even if it works in humans it might not be feasible to manufacture it. We have got medicine that costs over 3 million USD per dose, obviously there is a cost when the manufacturer just scraps the project even if it works perfectly.
- voisin 3y ago
  Thank you! I didn’t realize Pubmed had these options. I just found that it has “Create an RSS feed” of any search ter, which is fantastic. Thanks for the pointer!

kelnos 3y ago

Absolute layperson here, but: > In some cases, that means administering the very antigens that the rogue cells are trained to attack, a strategy that can deprogram the cells and dampen the autoimmune response. This sounds exactly like the strategy my allergy doc uses to suppress my allergies. Regularly expose my immune system to concentrated amounts of the allergens in order to deprogram the immune system's erroneous response. If it really is similar and analogous, I'm not really holding out much hope for this. Results from allergy shots seem to be all over the map. Yes, definitely positive results on average, that make it worth it for many people (myself included), but if it is indeed similar, I don't think this can be a general solution to these autoimmune diseases, that will work for everyone, or even most people. (Notably, the practice I go to is an "Immunology & Allergy" practice.) > Other researchers are trying to selectively wipe out the problematic cells, or to introduce suppressive immune cells that have been engineered to target them. This seems much more promising? Probably much more difficult, though, which I think makes the "deprogramming" method above worthwhile to look into, since it could potentially work well enough, for enough people, to make it worth the effort. Again, complete layperson here. If the immune system's response when it comes to allergies is nothing like the mechanisms in play when we're talking about autoimmune disorders, then... well, never mind, I guess.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
mattmaroon 3y ago
I think the biggest healthcare change of the next 50 years is going to be customized medicine. Instead of jamming a one-size-fits-all chemical into a pill or shot and just hoping it's good for everyone with a given problem, it'll be more like 3d printing. MRNA already is very much like that, though it's still in its infancy.
m3kw9 3y ago
You can say anything but I just let them go thru phase 3 first before talking
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

nullserver 3y ago

Sjögrens. Which is similar to Lupus. Diet changes can make a huge difference. Earlier the better. On many support forums I see a pattern of people using the various meds with mixed results. Then people starting to experiment with which foods they seem to do better with. Then discovering the auto immune protocol diet. A lot of people don’t wanna go to the effort, so won’t try it and complain about it. People that try it and actually follow it often have amazing results, and all their symptoms calm down. A lot of people just cannot give up the pizza and chips though.

hirvi74 3y ago
My issue with the dietary suggestions is that I have yet to see enough conclusive evidence that any of them work (especially long-term). I feel like much of the information is just a Survivorship Bias. Who blogs about the countless diets that failed to help them? My understanding is that even for those who receive positive results, such results are highly anecdotal and individually specific. One person goes vegan and is cured. Another goes on a strictly carnivore diet and is cured. Same can be said for Mediterranean Diet, Plant-based, keto, etc.. So, which one should be recommended? How many should one try before they give up? How long should they try before they give up? "Nightshades cause inflammation." How? Why? At what dosage -- one slick of bell pepper can't be equal to five pounds of tomatoes, right? Why is this an issue only in some people? I am not trying to dismiss the premise because there could be validity to dietary factors impacting disease prognosis, but part of me also wants to believe that if the treatments were as simple as dietary interventions, then a majority of people with AI diseases would be cured already. I refuse to accept the conspiracy that diets hold the hidden cure for a majority of AI diseases, and that Big Pharma and doctors wouldn't profit as much if people made dietary interventions, so that's why they keep people sick with AI diseases by only treating the symptoms. Accepting such would be ignoring that there is also an entire "Big Diet" industry that stands to make a profit off the same desperate people. All I am gonna say is that, Dr. Jonas Salk invented the first effective Polio vaccine, did not patent his findings, an thus released it for free so the world could be a better place. Dr. John Pagano apparently discovered a diet that helps treat/cure AI diseases. You can learn more about it for $64.22 on Amazon.
- 3y ago

ahstilde 3y ago

Technically, allergies are an autoimmune disease, and they're certainly effectively curable through a change in the immune response. We're increasing the availability of allergy immunotherapy with our company, Wyndly. https://www.wyndly.com/pages/immunotherapy https://www.wyndly.com/pages/immunotherapy I'd love to see this for more conditions.

anonymouskimmer 3y ago
Is it medically possible to make a combination sublingual drop for a variety of common allergies without side-effects? $250 for a test and then whatever payments to have a doctor prescribe it is out of reach for many. A single over-the-counter for the more common allergies, or even regional over-the-counters for regional allergens, would be reach a lot more people. For the serious allergic reactions I can see why a personalized plan would be required. But for the more mild reactions this seems hypothetically possible. Aside: If wondered for a bit whether something like honey blends of many regional honeys for young children older than 6 months would eliminate most of the seasonal pollen allergies that people develop from moving to other parts of the country/world. Edit to add: I believe you're wrong about the "technically" part. Allergies aren't attacking the body (therefore not "auto"), merely causing symptoms through the general immune response against the allergen. This is particularly aggravating to an individual because the immune response is long lasting, as it's impossible for the immune system to eliminate the foreign antigen when said antigen is prevalent in the environment.
- aitchnyu 3y ago
  I doubt it can be OTC. My sublingual immunotherapy was started in doctors office to monitor adverse symptoms and there was a dose ramp up over 4 weeks.
Metacelsus 3y ago
>Technically, allergies are an autoimmune disease No, autoimmune means an immune reaction against a human protein (which allergens are not).
- 3y ago

hirvi74 3y ago

I am not trying to be a downer, and I am a person who would greatly benefit from this type of cure having one autoimmune disorder myself. However, I'll just say that I will believe it when I see it. Until this is lumped in with the other innovations that a mere carrots on a stick like a cure for cancer, material that can replace plastic without compromise, flying cars, ability to regrow enamel/reverse dental caries, etc..

notamy 3y ago

This would be lovely if it pans out. I’ve been grappling with a neurological issue for a while now that might be autoimmune (testing inconclusive so far); fortunately the neurological symptoms are reversible, but having an autoimmune variant of this issue would be life-altering with how treatment progresses.

eaurouge 3y ago

> But what’s most surprising is that they have all stayed in remission, even after they began producing new B cells. It’s as if wiping out the B cells performed a reset on the immune system. Apparently repeated cycles of prolonged fasts can also trigger apoptosis and reset the immune system. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7474734/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7474734/

epgui 3y ago

Very interesting, and indeed promising, but IMO over-optimistic in the way the approach is presented.

jph 3y ago

Mast cells, histamines, allergies, and sensitivities are autoimmune areas that affect many millions of people, and intertwine with many medical conditions. If you're seeking information about these, especially real-world ways to help such as diet, fasting, nutrition, neural retraining, complementary and alternative medicine, and the like, here are my notes in progress with a bunch of chatGPT glossary pages. Feedback welcome. https://mastcell.help https://mastcell.help

drc500free 3y ago
Thanks for the resource, how have you found working with chatGPT for this sort of thing? If you have some sort of mast cell disease, did you happen to get the covid vaccine? Any issues?
- jph 3y ago
  ChatGPT is great. It's training me in all these topics, as fast as I can search and learn. It's helping me to talk with doctors and experts. It's helping me share what I'm learning with many more people on various patient groups. Yes I got the covid vaccine and boosters, and also flu, shingles, TDAP, etc. No issues. Are you aware that there's research that overlaps COVID and mast cell issues? For example: famotidine antihistamine activates the vagus nerve inflammatory reflex to attenuate cytokine storms. For me personally, I don't yet know my root cause. I'm ramping up on medical research papers, and trying a hundred or so kinds of treatments to see what helps.
  - drc500free 3y ago
    Didn't know that about famotidine, that's very interesting. My wife has HaT (she was in the NIH study) and MCAS, and got absolutely wiped out by her reaction to the first vaccine. One of her specialists told her she's seen that happen with a few other HaT patients. We've been considering everything ranging from hard science to total woo, with what's worked best documented here: https://edsetc.com/ https://edsetc.com/
    - 3y ago

m3kw9 3y ago

Maybe we are on our way out of medival style medicine and actually get a cure and stead of attacking it with ball and chain style therapies

JoyfulTurkey 3y ago
Cue Star Trek IV hospital scene with Bones.

supertofu 3y ago

Gosh, I hope so. I have UC (ulcerative colitis), and my quality of life can vary wildly depending on flare-ups. It's a pretty brutal condition, and a horrible way to live if the disease isn't well-managed by meds or other therapies.

JR1427 3y ago
Sorry to hear that your UC is hard to live with. I was diagnosed nearly 4 years ago during my first flare, after I had a COVID-like illness. I've been taking mesalazine ever since, and am grateful every day for another day without symptoms. I take mesalazine tablets daily, and mesalazine enema twice a week. (The latter is really not a big deal, once you've got used to it, and is apparently very effective at preventing flares. I started off doing them every day, and very slowly over the two years reduced to twice per week, which I can tolerate.) I think I'll continue taking medication indefinitely, as for me it is not worth the risk coming off it.
- felixg3 3y ago
  Another fellow UCer! I‘m on Upadacitinib (Rinvoq) after many failed medications now. So glad to hear you’re fine with enemas. They worked a long time for me, too.:)
- supertofu 3y ago
  I'm glad mesalamine is working for you. I failed mesalamine and moved on to Humira. The Humira gives me quality of life, but I still have mini-flares when sick, and I still have bleeding. I wish I could be off meds, but without the Humira I lose all function. It's horrifying.