5 ms·

It seems like companies are really tightening the screws further this year. When I got into this industry I figured the good times would roll for about 10 years

It seems like companies are really tightening the screws further this year. When I got into this industry I figured the good times would roll for about 10 years, and then it would be about time for another career change. "Make hay while the sun is shining", as they say. I'm right around that 10th year, and I think that prediction was accurate.

soneca 3y ago
Do you think there is a career out there better than (I assume) software development? My view is that we are still in pretty good times. Maybe not great, but everyone who kept their jobs is still earning a big salary. And everything else other than software development is worse (specifically if you bundle things like ML into “software development“). I am curious. What career would you change to?
- toomuchtodo 3y ago
  Attorney. Build a system, work from anywhere, make your own schedule. Hard to outsource.
  - atlasunshrugged 3y ago
    Really? I would have assumed that attorney is one of those jobs that is going to be hugely disrupted by AI. Should people new to the field bother if they aren't going to be top X% (5? 10?)?
    - cpursley 3y ago
      There's way more to legal work than filling out forms. The AI is going to replace legal assistants, not the attorneys themselves.
    - abc03 3y ago
      For people without the resources, yes. For people that have a problem and resources, no. They pay for the best and want to be sure it‘s watertight.
      - esafak 3y ago
        Just get into and through Harvard Law, easy peasy... The best programmers make good money too.
        toomuchtodo 3y ago
        Quality is determined by a combination of network, reputation, and results, not your Alma mater. Search for a securities or criminal defense attorney, ask around, see if where they got their diploma plays into the referrals you get.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - gamblor956 3y ago
      Actual legal work, as opposed to legal-adjacent tasks, will be the last to be disrupted by AI, at least so long as AI means LLM. Law is simply too complicated to rely on something that doesn't have the ability to understand. Doc review staff will be effectively eliminated...but they're already being eliminated by non-AI technology, so AI will just be the last straw.
      - kstrauser 3y ago
        I watched a tech demo of an LLM writing code to make a neat little user interface. I would have thought that utterly impossible a couple years ago. I don’t think this would be a good time to start a career drafting contracts.
      - oceanplexian 3y ago
        It’s not even the complicated part, these are fields where people still use fax machines and wouldn’t use teleconferencing until they were dragged kicking and screaming through COVID (And even then, lots of courts were like, nah, we’ll just close court for a year, too bad for you) Free market dynamics don’t apply. Healthcare is the same way because it’s controlled by an old guard backed up by the force of law. There is no way to disrupt because the system is rigged.
  - madmaxmcfly 3y ago
    Here I am the one to bring up AI, ugh. I get a sense that, of all things, LLM's actually encroach on legal professions the most (aside from copywriters). But this is from an outside perspective. Any insights?
    - toomuchtodo 3y ago
      If blockchain didn’t replace the law, neither is a hallucinating robot in the near term. Has to pass legal muster, not techbro bar. I say this as someone deeply involved in GRC in finance where a component of my work is working on improving LLM guardrails for knowledge management.
  - dpflan 3y ago
    What does build a system mean?
    - toomuchtodo 3y ago
      Focus on a niche, create a funnel, be very good at that niche, scale horizontally. EDIT: Picked attorney because you have to be licensed to practice law, creating a barrier to the equivalent of code bootcamps. My apologies if the model around the idea wasn't clear, I will do better!
      - dpflan 3y ago
        Why is this seemingly general rule so specific to law (being an attorney)?
        deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
        dpflan 3y ago
        The license is the key, as a barrier to entry. Medicine is very high and takes a lot of time but pretty impenetrable. Law is cheaper for the time and money. What else would have this property?
- claudiulodro 3y ago
  Self-employed tradesman pays as much on a per-hour basis as contract dev work and doesn't have to compete with a million people in developing countries willing to work for $20/hr. The project management parts from software development aren't too different either -- it's all tasks, coordinating stakeholders, etc. That's my angle, but there are plenty of other fields too: healthcare (nurses make as much as most SWEs and can live anywhere in the country), government, certain employee tradesmen (electrician, etc.), basically anything that requires some sort of license or training. Life is long, spending a couple years to get 10+ years of good returns is a wise investment. I've never been to the Bay Area, so what I'm about to say may not apply, but look in any middle-class neighborhood: maybe 5% of the people are in tech -- what is everyone else doing? The above is a sampling of careers that have provided people in my neighborhood a comfortable American Dream style of life.
  - Deprecate9151 3y ago
    I want to call this out because I see this advice a lot (and it's also my backup plan). Trade work can be a fantastic way to earn a living, but it is HARD work. It will break your body if you do it for your whole life. There is a reason plenty of people jumped to office work the first chance they got. Don't go into the trades blind, take care of your body, or you'll be like my grandpa and need help uncurling your fingers if you fall asleep making a fist.
    - bradfox2 3y ago
      You want a specialized trade. HV Electrician at a utility or something like that. An off the shelf commercial or residential trade sounds like a nightmare, especially in an area with bad weather part of the year. That said, if you can deal with employees of that type as a business owner, you can clean up.
  - oldandboring 3y ago
    > but look in any middle-class neighborhood: maybe 5% of the people are in tech -- what is everyone else doing? This comment is why I love HN. Once you sort through all the kiddos who don't know anything about anything, you get golden nuggets like this. In my middle (almost upper-middle) class neighborhood we have a bunch of doctors and psychologists, a bunch of lawyers, a few retired professionals, a couple professors and.... me in tech.
- blastro 3y ago
  Curious to the answers here, leaving a breadcrumb for later.

soneca 3y ago

Do you think there is a career out there better than (I assume) software development? My view is that we are still in pretty good times. Maybe not great, but everyone who kept their jobs is still earning a big salary. And everything else other than software development is worse (specifically if you bundle things like ML into “software development“). I am curious. What career would you change to?

toomuchtodo 3y ago
Attorney. Build a system, work from anywhere, make your own schedule. Hard to outsource.
- atlasunshrugged 3y ago
  Really? I would have assumed that attorney is one of those jobs that is going to be hugely disrupted by AI. Should people new to the field bother if they aren't going to be top X% (5? 10?)?
  - cpursley 3y ago
    There's way more to legal work than filling out forms. The AI is going to replace legal assistants, not the attorneys themselves.
  - abc03 3y ago
    For people without the resources, yes. For people that have a problem and resources, no. They pay for the best and want to be sure it‘s watertight.
    - esafak 3y ago
      Just get into and through Harvard Law, easy peasy... The best programmers make good money too.
      - toomuchtodo 3y ago
        Quality is determined by a combination of network, reputation, and results, not your Alma mater. Search for a securities or criminal defense attorney, ask around, see if where they got their diploma plays into the referrals you get.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - gamblor956 3y ago
    Actual legal work, as opposed to legal-adjacent tasks, will be the last to be disrupted by AI, at least so long as AI means LLM. Law is simply too complicated to rely on something that doesn't have the ability to understand. Doc review staff will be effectively eliminated...but they're already being eliminated by non-AI technology, so AI will just be the last straw.
    - kstrauser 3y ago
      I watched a tech demo of an LLM writing code to make a neat little user interface. I would have thought that utterly impossible a couple years ago. I don’t think this would be a good time to start a career drafting contracts.
    - oceanplexian 3y ago
      It’s not even the complicated part, these are fields where people still use fax machines and wouldn’t use teleconferencing until they were dragged kicking and screaming through COVID (And even then, lots of courts were like, nah, we’ll just close court for a year, too bad for you) Free market dynamics don’t apply. Healthcare is the same way because it’s controlled by an old guard backed up by the force of law. There is no way to disrupt because the system is rigged.
- madmaxmcfly 3y ago
  Here I am the one to bring up AI, ugh. I get a sense that, of all things, LLM's actually encroach on legal professions the most (aside from copywriters). But this is from an outside perspective. Any insights?
  - toomuchtodo 3y ago
    If blockchain didn’t replace the law, neither is a hallucinating robot in the near term. Has to pass legal muster, not techbro bar. I say this as someone deeply involved in GRC in finance where a component of my work is working on improving LLM guardrails for knowledge management.
- dpflan 3y ago
  What does build a system mean?
  - toomuchtodo 3y ago
    Focus on a niche, create a funnel, be very good at that niche, scale horizontally. EDIT: Picked attorney because you have to be licensed to practice law, creating a barrier to the equivalent of code bootcamps. My apologies if the model around the idea wasn't clear, I will do better!
    - dpflan 3y ago
      Why is this seemingly general rule so specific to law (being an attorney)?
      - deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
      - dpflan 3y ago
        The license is the key, as a barrier to entry. Medicine is very high and takes a lot of time but pretty impenetrable. Law is cheaper for the time and money. What else would have this property?
claudiulodro 3y ago
Self-employed tradesman pays as much on a per-hour basis as contract dev work and doesn't have to compete with a million people in developing countries willing to work for $20/hr. The project management parts from software development aren't too different either -- it's all tasks, coordinating stakeholders, etc. That's my angle, but there are plenty of other fields too: healthcare (nurses make as much as most SWEs and can live anywhere in the country), government, certain employee tradesmen (electrician, etc.), basically anything that requires some sort of license or training. Life is long, spending a couple years to get 10+ years of good returns is a wise investment. I've never been to the Bay Area, so what I'm about to say may not apply, but look in any middle-class neighborhood: maybe 5% of the people are in tech -- what is everyone else doing? The above is a sampling of careers that have provided people in my neighborhood a comfortable American Dream style of life.
- Deprecate9151 3y ago
  I want to call this out because I see this advice a lot (and it's also my backup plan). Trade work can be a fantastic way to earn a living, but it is HARD work. It will break your body if you do it for your whole life. There is a reason plenty of people jumped to office work the first chance they got. Don't go into the trades blind, take care of your body, or you'll be like my grandpa and need help uncurling your fingers if you fall asleep making a fist.
  - bradfox2 3y ago
    You want a specialized trade. HV Electrician at a utility or something like that. An off the shelf commercial or residential trade sounds like a nightmare, especially in an area with bad weather part of the year. That said, if you can deal with employees of that type as a business owner, you can clean up.
- oldandboring 3y ago
  > but look in any middle-class neighborhood: maybe 5% of the people are in tech -- what is everyone else doing? This comment is why I love HN. Once you sort through all the kiddos who don't know anything about anything, you get golden nuggets like this. In my middle (almost upper-middle) class neighborhood we have a bunch of doctors and psychologists, a bunch of lawyers, a few retired professionals, a couple professors and.... me in tech.
blastro 3y ago
Curious to the answers here, leaving a breadcrumb for later.