6 ms·

It is generally a good thing for folks who live paycheck to paycheck. Higher withholding forces more budgeting, and then they get a big paycheck once a year to

It is generally a good thing for folks who live paycheck to paycheck. Higher withholding forces more budgeting, and then they get a big paycheck once a year to pay off whatever

whamlastxmas 3y ago
It’s almost certainly a bad thing to get a big refund because small budgetary changes can result in being unable to make ends meet which is extremely expensive in terms of fines
chrisfinazzo 3y ago
In addition, I wouldn't be surprised to find that many of the people who are in the target demographic for this feature don't itemize - and never have a need for such practices. A 1040 + W2 might the only equation these people need to solve for.
burkaman 3y ago
People who live paycheck to paycheck are very good at budgeting because they have to do it to survive, they don't need any more pressure. If anything it's richer people that could use a little prodding, but either way we don't need the government to be withholding extra money from people it thinks might have bad habits. > they get a big paycheck once a year to pay off whatever If you have something big to pay off, you usually need to do it right away. You probably can't afford to wait however many months until you get your refund.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- fantasyfacts 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - devindotcom 3y ago
    you made an account just to talk shit about the poor?
    - Dalewyn 3y ago
      As far as I can be bothered to care, schemes involving having other people store your money such as tax withholdings and insurance policies exist primarily to save people from themselves and their lack of budgeting capabilities. Most people can't budget, poor people especially so (it's among the biggest and most likely reasons why they are poor). They see money, they spend it all immediately. Saving? Investing? "roflmao" or "I can't.", they will say. The only way to address this so certain, specific, important payments are made absolutely is to literally take and keep the money out of the person's hands until the payment is made.
    - lupusreal 3y ago
      It isn't "talking shit", what he's saying is broadly true and you're not doing poor people any favors by pretending otherwise.
    - erellsworth 3y ago
      Picked an appropriate username tho
  - WarOnPrivacy 3y ago
    > Whatever is left over after expenses is fun to be had as soon as possible. When income is 80% of the minimal bills, which dollars are the fun ones? > But anyone who has actually dealt with poor people who live paycheck to paycheck knows they are not good at budgeting and planning. You may not know that assertion is uneducated nonsense. The nonsensical part is the inference that better budgeting is all that stands between 80% of minimal bills and 105%. Past that, an extended time in hunger-level poverty tends to lead to some hyper-focused money management. As in being intimately aware of each penny that hopefully will add up to this weeks bag of white rice.
  - zo1 3y ago
    Some of the "better at planning" poor people have built up crude math to make it all makes sense, but seems overly complicated for someone like me. The one I noticed: "oh, I got $85 for selling that pot I made, I'll use that for the fridge repair." - Which is totally different to "oh I got $85, I'll just put it in the pool of my bank balance because I already budgeted for that fridge repair which costs $60". I tried asking this person, but you also needed an extra $10 for that McDonald's lunch you wanted to buy but they insisted "nope, that's my fridge-repair money, can't spend that" Not sure I'm explaining that properly, but it was the sort of math I encountered dealing with such individuals.
8note 3y ago
If they were budgeting, they wouldn't be living paycheck to paycheck. It makes the budgeting more challenging to give the government and interest free loan. However, giving the government an automatic loan means that a land lord cannot charge that much more in rent, and the owner does get to spend it eventually, rather than throwing it into a rent pit
- Broken_Hippo 3y ago
  If they were budgeting, they wouldn't be living paycheck to paycheck. This is false. You simply aren't going to be able to budget your way into riches if you don't have enough money to go around. If you don't believe me, limit yourself to a minimum wage budget with no startup savings (and no borrowing off of others) and tell me how you are doing in a year... and then tell me how you'd survive the next few years on this. If minimum wage is too little, try setting the income at just over the mark you'd have for assistance. Alternatively, if you have enough money to cover reasonable expenses, some fun, and have a little leftover, you don't really have to budget if you don't tend to spend lots. If I have enough money, I don't really have to budget.
- Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
  > If they were budgeting, they wouldn't be living paycheck to paycheck You are insultingly out of touch. I'd like to paint you my picture of my life in 2009 and then compare it to today's numbers. I was making $10.75/hr at a Subway, working ~38 hours/week. That's ~$1600 pretax, about $1,200 post-tax. Expenses: Rent (Single-bedroom apartment): 650 car insurance: 75 water/sewage/garbage: 40 internet: 30 phone: 30 electricity: 50 That left me with $325/month to pay for gas (luckily I loved only ~3 miles from work, so that didn't cost me much), food, and entertainment. $10/day for food wasn't terrible, but it's not exactly steak and seafood, either. And remember, that $10/day is supposed to include entertainment as well. Honestly, it wasn't really THAT bad. Buuuuut.... Minimum wage increases have happened, but rent has gone up too. That job would now pay $15/hr, ($2280 for 38 hours pretax, ~$1710 post-tax), but the rent on that exact same unit is now $1,200/month. Assuming all other bills remained the same (they wouldn't), I'd now be left with only $285/month for food. And with over 15 years of inflation, that $285 is worth significantly less. At that point, even with budgeting, I'd still be living paycheck-to-paycheck. When wages don't keep up with the cost of living, you can't budget your way out of it. To make it worse, that kind of living starts to take its toll on mental health. You feel like you're constantly drowning. That $4 coffee or the meal at Taco Bell will be your only source of real joy between each paycheck.

It is generally a good thing for folks who live paycheck to paycheck. Higher withholding forces more budgeting, and then they get a big paycheck once a year to pay off whatever

whamlastxmas 3y ago

It’s almost certainly a bad thing to get a big refund because small budgetary changes can result in being unable to make ends meet which is extremely expensive in terms of fines

chrisfinazzo 3y ago

In addition, I wouldn't be surprised to find that many of the people who are in the target demographic for this feature don't itemize - and never have a need for such practices. A 1040 + W2 might the only equation these people need to solve for.

burkaman 3y ago

People who live paycheck to paycheck are very good at budgeting because they have to do it to survive, they don't need any more pressure. If anything it's richer people that could use a little prodding, but either way we don't need the government to be withholding extra money from people it thinks might have bad habits. > they get a big paycheck once a year to pay off whatever If you have something big to pay off, you usually need to do it right away. You probably can't afford to wait however many months until you get your refund.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
fantasyfacts 3y ago
[flagged]
- devindotcom 3y ago
  you made an account just to talk shit about the poor?
  - Dalewyn 3y ago
    As far as I can be bothered to care, schemes involving having other people store your money such as tax withholdings and insurance policies exist primarily to save people from themselves and their lack of budgeting capabilities. Most people can't budget, poor people especially so (it's among the biggest and most likely reasons why they are poor). They see money, they spend it all immediately. Saving? Investing? "roflmao" or "I can't.", they will say. The only way to address this so certain, specific, important payments are made absolutely is to literally take and keep the money out of the person's hands until the payment is made.
  - lupusreal 3y ago
    It isn't "talking shit", what he's saying is broadly true and you're not doing poor people any favors by pretending otherwise.
  - erellsworth 3y ago
    Picked an appropriate username tho
- WarOnPrivacy 3y ago
  > Whatever is left over after expenses is fun to be had as soon as possible. When income is 80% of the minimal bills, which dollars are the fun ones? > But anyone who has actually dealt with poor people who live paycheck to paycheck knows they are not good at budgeting and planning. You may not know that assertion is uneducated nonsense. The nonsensical part is the inference that better budgeting is all that stands between 80% of minimal bills and 105%. Past that, an extended time in hunger-level poverty tends to lead to some hyper-focused money management. As in being intimately aware of each penny that hopefully will add up to this weeks bag of white rice.
- zo1 3y ago
  Some of the "better at planning" poor people have built up crude math to make it all makes sense, but seems overly complicated for someone like me. The one I noticed: "oh, I got $85 for selling that pot I made, I'll use that for the fridge repair." - Which is totally different to "oh I got $85, I'll just put it in the pool of my bank balance because I already budgeted for that fridge repair which costs $60". I tried asking this person, but you also needed an extra $10 for that McDonald's lunch you wanted to buy but they insisted "nope, that's my fridge-repair money, can't spend that" Not sure I'm explaining that properly, but it was the sort of math I encountered dealing with such individuals.

8note 3y ago

If they were budgeting, they wouldn't be living paycheck to paycheck. It makes the budgeting more challenging to give the government and interest free loan. However, giving the government an automatic loan means that a land lord cannot charge that much more in rent, and the owner does get to spend it eventually, rather than throwing it into a rent pit

Broken_Hippo 3y ago
If they were budgeting, they wouldn't be living paycheck to paycheck. This is false. You simply aren't going to be able to budget your way into riches if you don't have enough money to go around. If you don't believe me, limit yourself to a minimum wage budget with no startup savings (and no borrowing off of others) and tell me how you are doing in a year... and then tell me how you'd survive the next few years on this. If minimum wage is too little, try setting the income at just over the mark you'd have for assistance. Alternatively, if you have enough money to cover reasonable expenses, some fun, and have a little leftover, you don't really have to budget if you don't tend to spend lots. If I have enough money, I don't really have to budget.
Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
> If they were budgeting, they wouldn't be living paycheck to paycheck You are insultingly out of touch. I'd like to paint you my picture of my life in 2009 and then compare it to today's numbers. I was making $10.75/hr at a Subway, working ~38 hours/week. That's ~$1600 pretax, about $1,200 post-tax. Expenses: Rent (Single-bedroom apartment): 650 car insurance: 75 water/sewage/garbage: 40 internet: 30 phone: 30 electricity: 50 That left me with $325/month to pay for gas (luckily I loved only ~3 miles from work, so that didn't cost me much), food, and entertainment. $10/day for food wasn't terrible, but it's not exactly steak and seafood, either. And remember, that $10/day is supposed to include entertainment as well. Honestly, it wasn't really THAT bad. Buuuuut.... Minimum wage increases have happened, but rent has gone up too. That job would now pay $15/hr, ($2280 for 38 hours pretax, ~$1710 post-tax), but the rent on that exact same unit is now $1,200/month. Assuming all other bills remained the same (they wouldn't), I'd now be left with only $285/month for food. And with over 15 years of inflation, that $285 is worth significantly less. At that point, even with budgeting, I'd still be living paycheck-to-paycheck. When wages don't keep up with the cost of living, you can't budget your way out of it. To make it worse, that kind of living starts to take its toll on mental health. You feel like you're constantly drowning. That $4 coffee or the meal at Taco Bell will be your only source of real joy between each paycheck.