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But reality isn't a story. It's a nameless, formless, infinitely deep thing. And you don't need a story to navigate it either. A story (map, theory, etc) is ju
by swayvil 3y ago
But reality isn't a story. It's a nameless, formless, infinitely deep thing.
And you don't need a story to navigate it either. A story (map, theory, etc) is just one (immensely popular) way.
Maybe our deep concern with stories is the issue. Like a man who puts his head in a sack and then complains about the dark
- bowsamic 3y agoWell, it's the only thing we can concern our minds with, since anything we think about falls under the category of "story" as you note by synonymising it with "map" and "theory". Sure, we can just simply live, and we must, indeed, actually just exist in this world, but it's hard to interpret your comment as anything other than "just stop the mind", which to me doesn't seem particularly productive. You haven't really argued that it's limiting to be deeply concerned with stories, you just say that it's blinding but haven't justified why. Is it also blinding when a man is deeply concerned with the physical act of eating, or with the act of walking?
- swayvil 3y agoI did not mean to suggest any kind of exclusivity. No "just live" or "just stop the mind". What I offer is a bit of perspective. The mind only looks big when your nose is buried in it. And when your nose is buried in it all you see is mind stuff, stories become central, and mind-related problems look like mountains. It's a tempest in a teapot situation. (Also, it's limiting to be deeply concerned with stories because doing so concentrates your attention into stories and mind, rendering all else dim to invisible. It's that trick of perspective. And then when everybody you know is doing the same thing and that's all that anybody talks about, then reality becomes just a story)
- bowsamic 3y agoRight, but it's impossible to get out of the mind, so what's the problem? We can never leave the perspective of mind
- swayvil 3y ago>but it's impossible to get out of the mind... That's bold. A million monks, mystics, meditators, artists and hallucinogen enthusiasts might argue otherwise. But arguments probably wouldn't make a dent.
- bowsamic 3y agoIt's bold to claim that we are limited to our perspective as individual human consciousnesses? I mean, I don't really care what "a million monks, mystics, meditators, artists and hallucinogen enthusiasts" say, no one really has any convincing evidence or argument that such a thing is possible. I say this as a former practitioner of Zen and still a Buddhist today, in fact from a Buddhist perspective what I'm saying is an idea in yogachara philosophy. Ultimately, I can't think of a less bold claim than "we can't leave our own minds"
- swayvil 3y agoWell as a present practitioner, I say it's possible, done every day, and more common than you think. And I don't care how many old secondhand books you stand on.
- bowsamic 3y agoAgain, that's a far more bold claim, I've never met anyone who has done it and you are the first person I've ever heard claim to know of it, even though I've been steeped in meditative and spiritual traditions for a few years now. Anyway, this is just a pointless back and forth, however you should at least out of basic courtesy not pretend to act shocked that I repeat the basic truth of 99.999% of human beings' existences. That I honestly have to say I find almost rude!
- swayvil 3y agoDon't get your robe in a rumple Mr funny haircut. The truth is stranger than etc.