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Leaving debt for your children but don't want the shame? I have a solution, leave so much debt that nobody could even imagine your children paying it all off, t

Leaving debt for your children but don't want the shame? I have a solution, leave so much debt that nobody could even imagine your children paying it all off, that way you can say condescending stuff like "will likely choose not to pay it, it isn't written in stone" while writing that they will service that debt forever in stone.

ta1243 3y ago
If you don't pay, who doesn't get what they are due? Who specifically is reliant on that repayment in the future? How will their life be worse if they don't get repaid? Does anyone actually know? What most Americans want is a solid job, a house in a quiet area with a couple of kids and a dog, room to swing a cat, being able to get home for dinner at 6, the ability to get around and do a few things. Basically the Homer Simpson style life (without the wacky adventures) That used to be achievable for most people. It's not now.
- peteradio 3y ago
  In the case of USA, the debt is Govt debt so it means Govt shutdowns cutbacks etc. Every other board in the house was burned for extra warmth. Now our economy is "service" based, I guess that is some sort of inter-generational joke where we are now expected to go "service" ourselves.
  - rsynnott 3y ago
    Huh? In general when people die with net debts, it's not to the government; it's mortgages and other consumer debt.
    - peteradio 3y ago
      I'm not saying Govt is inheriting personal debts. I'm saying the bigger issue is the Govt debt as a percentage of a largely bullshit economy.
  - roenxi 3y ago
    Imagine the government prints the money and closes the debt that way. Nobody in the present has lost anything they can point to. They lost a promise which isn't worth much. The person who lent the capital could have bought something nice ... however many years ago. Today, they just have to recognise that they made a mistake many years ago. They gave a gift and mis-recorded it as an asset in their accounts. At this point, there isn't really a plausible path where the US debt gets paid down. The plausible path where they pay interest on the debt is also vanishing, 5% interest rates are overwhelming the ability of the US to pay. They are well on the path where even rolling over the principle will be infeasible. Anyone who believes it is a safe bet that they get paid back in real terms is rather optimistic, they're gambling. And in that environment, why should the inheritors of the debt play along in this silly game? They'll print and be done with it. Personal debt is also a non-issue, where I imagine it gets extinguished on death. There isn't really a path here where future generations get saddled with debt. The problem is they'll have a future where their parents didn't build enough infrastructure. I suppose the video might be about the UK, but the situation there would be largely similar to in the US, on a smaller scale. The problem is the lack of investment in the past, not the debt in the present.
    - willcipriano 3y ago
      > Imagine the government prints the money and closes the debt that way. Nobody in the present has lost anything they can point to. Cool, why don't the boomers lead the way with this innovative plan while their retirement is on the line, instead of waiting to be clear of the blast zone?
      - roenxi 3y ago
        They are. Nobody is planning on paying the US debt back by repaying it, for example. That option has been all but officially ruled out. The printing is an ongoing thing.
  - ta1243 3y ago
    The US governemnt currently "owes" $34,000 billion. Who specifically is relying on that debt being paid back? What will happen to them if they don't have that debt repaid? What will they do with that money if the debt is repaid?
- sp332 3y ago
  For a loan with a house as collateral, an unpaid debt means foreclosure. This is a hassle for the bank but not an existential threat.
- rayiner 3y ago
  > That used to be achievable for most people. It's not now. That’s not really true. Home ownership rates for, example, are higher today than in 1950. And houses are twice as big as they were back then.
  - ttyprintk 3y ago
    The whole point of this post is that statistics in aggregate obscure the effects between generations. The first-time homebuyer is now the smallest proportion ever among homebuyers, and doing so at the oldest age recorded.
    - rayiner 3y ago
      It’s not really that different breaking it down by generation: https://www.redfin.com/news/gen-z-millennial-homeownership-rate-home-purchases https://www.redfin.com/news/gen-z-millennial-homeownership-r.... Millennials have somewhat lower home ownership rates than boomers did at the same age, but I suspect most of the difference can be explained by: 1) millennials starting their lives four years later due to college becoming much more common; 2) millennials choosing to live in urban areas rather than cheaper suburbs, as compared to boomers.
      - ttyprintk 3y ago
        That’s a great article. I suspect the difference in statistics is that RedFin only represents mortgages, not the 30% of sales in cash. I’m not sure it supports point 2), though. The comparison is between millennial and Gen Z.
rsynnott 3y ago
> while writing that they will service that debt forever in stone. Eh? In general, in most jurisdictions, debt essentially dies with the debtor; if it can't be paid from the proceeds of the estate, then that's the end of it.

ta1243 3y ago

If you don't pay, who doesn't get what they are due? Who specifically is reliant on that repayment in the future? How will their life be worse if they don't get repaid? Does anyone actually know? What most Americans want is a solid job, a house in a quiet area with a couple of kids and a dog, room to swing a cat, being able to get home for dinner at 6, the ability to get around and do a few things. Basically the Homer Simpson style life (without the wacky adventures) That used to be achievable for most people. It's not now.

peteradio 3y ago
In the case of USA, the debt is Govt debt so it means Govt shutdowns cutbacks etc. Every other board in the house was burned for extra warmth. Now our economy is "service" based, I guess that is some sort of inter-generational joke where we are now expected to go "service" ourselves.
- rsynnott 3y ago
  Huh? In general when people die with net debts, it's not to the government; it's mortgages and other consumer debt.
  - peteradio 3y ago
    I'm not saying Govt is inheriting personal debts. I'm saying the bigger issue is the Govt debt as a percentage of a largely bullshit economy.
- roenxi 3y ago
  Imagine the government prints the money and closes the debt that way. Nobody in the present has lost anything they can point to. They lost a promise which isn't worth much. The person who lent the capital could have bought something nice ... however many years ago. Today, they just have to recognise that they made a mistake many years ago. They gave a gift and mis-recorded it as an asset in their accounts. At this point, there isn't really a plausible path where the US debt gets paid down. The plausible path where they pay interest on the debt is also vanishing, 5% interest rates are overwhelming the ability of the US to pay. They are well on the path where even rolling over the principle will be infeasible. Anyone who believes it is a safe bet that they get paid back in real terms is rather optimistic, they're gambling. And in that environment, why should the inheritors of the debt play along in this silly game? They'll print and be done with it. Personal debt is also a non-issue, where I imagine it gets extinguished on death. There isn't really a path here where future generations get saddled with debt. The problem is they'll have a future where their parents didn't build enough infrastructure. I suppose the video might be about the UK, but the situation there would be largely similar to in the US, on a smaller scale. The problem is the lack of investment in the past, not the debt in the present.
  - willcipriano 3y ago
    > Imagine the government prints the money and closes the debt that way. Nobody in the present has lost anything they can point to. Cool, why don't the boomers lead the way with this innovative plan while their retirement is on the line, instead of waiting to be clear of the blast zone?
    - roenxi 3y ago
      They are. Nobody is planning on paying the US debt back by repaying it, for example. That option has been all but officially ruled out. The printing is an ongoing thing.
- ta1243 3y ago
  The US governemnt currently "owes" $34,000 billion. Who specifically is relying on that debt being paid back? What will happen to them if they don't have that debt repaid? What will they do with that money if the debt is repaid?
sp332 3y ago
For a loan with a house as collateral, an unpaid debt means foreclosure. This is a hassle for the bank but not an existential threat.
rayiner 3y ago
> That used to be achievable for most people. It's not now. That’s not really true. Home ownership rates for, example, are higher today than in 1950. And houses are twice as big as they were back then.
- ttyprintk 3y ago
  The whole point of this post is that statistics in aggregate obscure the effects between generations. The first-time homebuyer is now the smallest proportion ever among homebuyers, and doing so at the oldest age recorded.
  - rayiner 3y ago
    It’s not really that different breaking it down by generation: https://www.redfin.com/news/gen-z-millennial-homeownership-rate-home-purchases https://www.redfin.com/news/gen-z-millennial-homeownership-r.... Millennials have somewhat lower home ownership rates than boomers did at the same age, but I suspect most of the difference can be explained by: 1) millennials starting their lives four years later due to college becoming much more common; 2) millennials choosing to live in urban areas rather than cheaper suburbs, as compared to boomers.
    - ttyprintk 3y ago
      That’s a great article. I suspect the difference in statistics is that RedFin only represents mortgages, not the 30% of sales in cash. I’m not sure it supports point 2), though. The comparison is between millennial and Gen Z.

rsynnott 3y ago

> while writing that they will service that debt forever in stone. Eh? In general, in most jurisdictions, debt essentially dies with the debtor; if it can't be paid from the proceeds of the estate, then that's the end of it.