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> being a dissident blogger is practically a capital crime Oh, for f*ck's sake. Hacker News and unbridled exaggeration, name a better combination. Look, I ge

> being a dissident blogger is practically a capital crime Oh, for f*ck's sake. Hacker News and unbridled exaggeration, name a better combination. Look, I get that Singapore's leaders are especially litigious, and they are rightly criticised for it by a plurality of the population. However, a defamation lawsuit is a far cry from a death sentence. Somehow I get the feeling most commenters who criticise Singapore for its 'draconian authoritarian totalitarian xyz-itarian oligarchic police state laws' have never set foot in the place.

refurb 3y ago
Sure "capital crime" is hyperbole, but the authoritarian nature of the government is well known. I mean a guy was arrested for holding up a piece of cardboard with a smiley face drawn on it for a few seconds while someone took a picture of it. This was deemed "unlawful assembly without a permit". He had already spent time in prison for prior protests in support of Hong Kong. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/24/singapore-smiley-face-activist-in-one-man-protest-charged-with-unlawful-assembly https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/24/singapore-smil...
- delta_p_delta_x 3y ago
  > "unlawful assembly without a permit" Dunno why you put it in quotes: it's in Singapore law[1]. [1]: Public Order Act 2009: https://sso.agc.gov.sg/Act/POA2009 https://sso.agc.gov.sg/Act/POA2009
hnfong 3y ago
> Somehow I get the feeling most commenters who criticise Singapore for its 'draconian authoritarian totalitarian xyz-itarian oligarchic police state laws' have never set foot in the place. Rather ironically, if the original comment about "dissident blogger is a capital crime" is literally true, your observation basically confirms it due to survival bias, because nobody could criticize Singapore's government while being physically there. :) That said, I think the truth is somewhere in the middle.
pydry 3y ago
>However, a defamation lawsuit is a far cry from a death sentence. Defamation lawsuits in Singapore are far worse than in the west. They are both rigged and designed to bankrupt you. Being a target wont mean you get killed but it will ruin your life. >Somehow I get the feeling most commenters who criticise Singapore for its 'draconian authoritarian totalitarian xyz-itarian oligarchic police state laws' have never set foot in the place. I lived there. I was there for the riots and I was there for the bus drivers strike where the police violently brutalized the foreign strikers for having the temerity to object to racial pay scales. Hacker news opinion mostly comes from people who went to Singapore on holiday once and now thinks theyre an expert on it or white people who lived there liked being near the top of the racial hierarchy.
- delta_p_delta_x 3y ago
  > They are both rigged and designed to bankrupt you They're not much worse than in what goes on in England[1], it would appear. Anyway, I said as much myself, but I was pointing out your ridiculous hyperbole. I'll say it again—a defamation lawsuit, however heavy the penalty, is nowhere close to a death sentence. This is all the more confusing, since Singapore actually has the capital penalty for certain crimes. Funny you choose to call out defamation lawsuits, of all things. > I lived there. I was there for the riots and I was there for the bus drivers strike where the police violently brutalized the foreign strikers for having the temerity to object to racial pay scales There is so much wrong with this statement I don't even know where to start. Firstly, I'm guessing you did not 'live there': you lived in an expat bubble taking home six-plus digits with your family taken care of, chauffeured between work and your Holland Village/Bukit Timah/River Valley condo in a taxi or car that your expat package paid for. Next, the bus riots started because of drunk and disorderly behaviour. The police never brutalised anyone, and there was widespread commentary amongst locals about just how many policemen were needed to control the situation, and how meek they were (which makes sense, given the civil defence and the police in Singapore are largely conscripts aged 19 – 22). Finally, nothing 'brutal' happened even in the bus strikes the year before. They were arrested, and deported. Full stop. It exasperates me to no end when foreigners nitpick on some so-called affront to freedom in Singapore (that doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things), when there are more serious and insidious issues that deeply affect the local (and even migrant populace) like male-only conscription, the skyrocketing cost of living, the car-first urban planning despite Singapore's government supposedly despising cars, and the classism and racism going on. Notice both you and someone else who pointed this out in this thread, which I upvoted—because it is fact, and not rage-baiting hyperbole. I am inclined to take anyone less seriously if they complain about 'police brutality' in Singapore. The Singapore police are amongst the meekest and friendliest lot I've ever seen. [1]: https://www.economist.com/1843/2023/12/01/britains-scariest-libel-firm-can-pursue-anyone-anywhere https://www.economist.com/1843/2023/12/01/britains-scariest-...

refurb 3y ago

Sure "capital crime" is hyperbole, but the authoritarian nature of the government is well known. I mean a guy was arrested for holding up a piece of cardboard with a smiley face drawn on it for a few seconds while someone took a picture of it. This was deemed "unlawful assembly without a permit". He had already spent time in prison for prior protests in support of Hong Kong. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/24/singapore-smiley-face-activist-in-one-man-protest-charged-with-unlawful-assembly https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/24/singapore-smil...

delta_p_delta_x 3y ago
> "unlawful assembly without a permit" Dunno why you put it in quotes: it's in Singapore law[1]. [1]: Public Order Act 2009: https://sso.agc.gov.sg/Act/POA2009 https://sso.agc.gov.sg/Act/POA2009

hnfong 3y ago

> Somehow I get the feeling most commenters who criticise Singapore for its 'draconian authoritarian totalitarian xyz-itarian oligarchic police state laws' have never set foot in the place. Rather ironically, if the original comment about "dissident blogger is a capital crime" is literally true, your observation basically confirms it due to survival bias, because nobody could criticize Singapore's government while being physically there. :) That said, I think the truth is somewhere in the middle.

pydry 3y ago

>However, a defamation lawsuit is a far cry from a death sentence. Defamation lawsuits in Singapore are far worse than in the west. They are both rigged and designed to bankrupt you. Being a target wont mean you get killed but it will ruin your life. >Somehow I get the feeling most commenters who criticise Singapore for its 'draconian authoritarian totalitarian xyz-itarian oligarchic police state laws' have never set foot in the place. I lived there. I was there for the riots and I was there for the bus drivers strike where the police violently brutalized the foreign strikers for having the temerity to object to racial pay scales. Hacker news opinion mostly comes from people who went to Singapore on holiday once and now thinks theyre an expert on it or white people who lived there liked being near the top of the racial hierarchy.

delta_p_delta_x 3y ago
> They are both rigged and designed to bankrupt you They're not much worse than in what goes on in England[1], it would appear. Anyway, I said as much myself, but I was pointing out your ridiculous hyperbole. I'll say it again—a defamation lawsuit, however heavy the penalty, is nowhere close to a death sentence. This is all the more confusing, since Singapore actually has the capital penalty for certain crimes. Funny you choose to call out defamation lawsuits, of all things. > I lived there. I was there for the riots and I was there for the bus drivers strike where the police violently brutalized the foreign strikers for having the temerity to object to racial pay scales There is so much wrong with this statement I don't even know where to start. Firstly, I'm guessing you did not 'live there': you lived in an expat bubble taking home six-plus digits with your family taken care of, chauffeured between work and your Holland Village/Bukit Timah/River Valley condo in a taxi or car that your expat package paid for. Next, the bus riots started because of drunk and disorderly behaviour. The police never brutalised anyone, and there was widespread commentary amongst locals about just how many policemen were needed to control the situation, and how meek they were (which makes sense, given the civil defence and the police in Singapore are largely conscripts aged 19 – 22). Finally, nothing 'brutal' happened even in the bus strikes the year before. They were arrested, and deported. Full stop. It exasperates me to no end when foreigners nitpick on some so-called affront to freedom in Singapore (that doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things), when there are more serious and insidious issues that deeply affect the local (and even migrant populace) like male-only conscription, the skyrocketing cost of living, the car-first urban planning despite Singapore's government supposedly despising cars, and the classism and racism going on. Notice both you and someone else who pointed this out in this thread, which I upvoted—because it is fact, and not rage-baiting hyperbole. I am inclined to take anyone less seriously if they complain about 'police brutality' in Singapore. The Singapore police are amongst the meekest and friendliest lot I've ever seen. [1]: https://www.economist.com/1843/2023/12/01/britains-scariest-libel-firm-can-pursue-anyone-anywhere https://www.economist.com/1843/2023/12/01/britains-scariest-...