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0 degrees Celsius is 32 degrees Fahrenheit so we’re not talking about the same kinda of temperatures here. You’re talking about right at freezing, which can be

0 degrees Celsius is 32 degrees Fahrenheit so we’re not talking about the same kinda of temperatures here. You’re talking about right at freezing, which can be common most everywhere in the northern hemisphere at least. The other is quite a bit colder but still common in the Midwest and actually cold places. This seems like a bad faith comment when looked at in that context.

thebruce87m 3y ago
I’m sure most people on Hacker News are smart enough to realise I wasn’t saying it was equivalent since those are very different temperatures. Heat pump performance doesn’t scale linearly either, but even at 3x worse performance I could last for a long, long time stuck in a snow storm.
- edgyquant 3y ago
  No I don’t think so, the implication was that you were comparing them and saying it was overblown. These Teslas are having issues at single digit/zero degree Fahrenheit so your anecdotal rebuttal isn’t useful.
  - thebruce87m 3y ago
    I think you’re missing my point. I’ll choose the best faith and assume I didn’t convey it properly rather than you are intentionally missing it. Here it is again: * I live in Scotland * I am subject to Scottish weather * In my Scottish weather the car operates just fine * My conservative friends are sharing stories of a handful of issues people are having in another country as proof of… something. Not sure exactly what but some culture war thing they have been tricked into spreading by their influencers. * Tesla stories are therefore amplified. There were a bunch of ICE cars also having issues but you don’t hear about them.
    - b112 3y ago
      There are absolutely zero ICE cars having issues at 0F, let alone -40C, unless they are defective, or poorly maintained. Frankly, you're making a false equivalence here. You're conflating "teslas in perfect factory delivery order" not working at normal winter temps, with "a poorly maintained or defective ICE car" not working. It's not the same thing. At all. I've driven all sorts of cars sold in North America, and -40C? Fine. I've owned VWs, Toyotas, GMs, my neighbours have all manner of cars. No one has problems with -40C. No one. ICE cars, in good working order are fine, and start and work reliability at -40C. Teslas, it would seem, do not. That is not someone picking on EVs. Really, EV tech is very new, compared to ICE.
      - thebruce87m 3y ago
        You’re saying that ICE cars don’t have issues at -40C? I can’t possibly take this to be good faith in any way. And any evidence I could provide you will claim that they are “poorly maintained”. No thanks, I’ve got better things to do.
        ImPostingOnHN 3y ago
        > You’re saying that ICE cars don’t have issues at -40C? They seem to be saying, > ICE cars, in good working order are fine, and start and work reliability at -40C. ...and they're mostly correct. In that sort of weather, you just use a bit higher concentration of antifreeze in your coolant mixture. Fuel will usually start freezing at a colder temperature as well. Hope you enjoy doing your things! p.s.) fun fact: one need not specify C or F or K when the value is -40 degrees :)
        thebruce87m 3y ago
        I have no experience with those temperatures but it seems that cars that are exposed to these conditions need a whole host of ways to deal with it, special fluids, block heaters and systems to automatically start the car if it falls below certain temperatures. Given that I think if we had a -40 snap in Scotland a great many brand new in-spec ICE cars would fail to start. Or is this all wrong and you can just turn the key on any old ICE and go? Genuine question since I don’t live in conditions like those. And reading the Reddit thread here suggests that a great many EV owners are doing just fine in extreme temperatures: https://www.reddit.com/r/Calgary/comments/194yg8x/how_are_your_evs_doing_in_this_weather_genuinely/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Calgary/comments/194yg8x/how_are_yo... Maybe that’s not -40 and they’ll all fail then?
    - edgyquant 3y ago
      stop acting like I’m the idiot or the one acting in bad faith here. You responded to a comment about 0 degrees Fahrenheit temperatures making teslas work way worse than normal with a comment that you were relaxing in yours in 0 degrees Celsius. Any way you try to walk it back is just that. I’m not missing the point, you’ve changed the point now that you’re being downvoted for this obviously false equivalency.
      - thebruce87m 3y ago
        I’ve explained my point in two different ways. My point was related to Tesla stories being amplified. I can’t give an anecdote about -40C temperatures since I don’t experience those in my country. I don’t know why I’m being downvoted, maybe there are other people like you determined to interpret it the wrong way.

thebruce87m 3y ago

I’m sure most people on Hacker News are smart enough to realise I wasn’t saying it was equivalent since those are very different temperatures. Heat pump performance doesn’t scale linearly either, but even at 3x worse performance I could last for a long, long time stuck in a snow storm.

edgyquant 3y ago
No I don’t think so, the implication was that you were comparing them and saying it was overblown. These Teslas are having issues at single digit/zero degree Fahrenheit so your anecdotal rebuttal isn’t useful.
- thebruce87m 3y ago
  I think you’re missing my point. I’ll choose the best faith and assume I didn’t convey it properly rather than you are intentionally missing it. Here it is again: * I live in Scotland * I am subject to Scottish weather * In my Scottish weather the car operates just fine * My conservative friends are sharing stories of a handful of issues people are having in another country as proof of… something. Not sure exactly what but some culture war thing they have been tricked into spreading by their influencers. * Tesla stories are therefore amplified. There were a bunch of ICE cars also having issues but you don’t hear about them.
  - b112 3y ago
    There are absolutely zero ICE cars having issues at 0F, let alone -40C, unless they are defective, or poorly maintained. Frankly, you're making a false equivalence here. You're conflating "teslas in perfect factory delivery order" not working at normal winter temps, with "a poorly maintained or defective ICE car" not working. It's not the same thing. At all. I've driven all sorts of cars sold in North America, and -40C? Fine. I've owned VWs, Toyotas, GMs, my neighbours have all manner of cars. No one has problems with -40C. No one. ICE cars, in good working order are fine, and start and work reliability at -40C. Teslas, it would seem, do not. That is not someone picking on EVs. Really, EV tech is very new, compared to ICE.
    - thebruce87m 3y ago
      You’re saying that ICE cars don’t have issues at -40C? I can’t possibly take this to be good faith in any way. And any evidence I could provide you will claim that they are “poorly maintained”. No thanks, I’ve got better things to do.
      - ImPostingOnHN 3y ago
        > You’re saying that ICE cars don’t have issues at -40C? They seem to be saying, > ICE cars, in good working order are fine, and start and work reliability at -40C. ...and they're mostly correct. In that sort of weather, you just use a bit higher concentration of antifreeze in your coolant mixture. Fuel will usually start freezing at a colder temperature as well. Hope you enjoy doing your things! p.s.) fun fact: one need not specify C or F or K when the value is -40 degrees :)
        thebruce87m 3y ago
        I have no experience with those temperatures but it seems that cars that are exposed to these conditions need a whole host of ways to deal with it, special fluids, block heaters and systems to automatically start the car if it falls below certain temperatures. Given that I think if we had a -40 snap in Scotland a great many brand new in-spec ICE cars would fail to start. Or is this all wrong and you can just turn the key on any old ICE and go? Genuine question since I don’t live in conditions like those. And reading the Reddit thread here suggests that a great many EV owners are doing just fine in extreme temperatures: https://www.reddit.com/r/Calgary/comments/194yg8x/how_are_your_evs_doing_in_this_weather_genuinely/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Calgary/comments/194yg8x/how_are_yo... Maybe that’s not -40 and they’ll all fail then?
  - edgyquant 3y ago
    stop acting like I’m the idiot or the one acting in bad faith here. You responded to a comment about 0 degrees Fahrenheit temperatures making teslas work way worse than normal with a comment that you were relaxing in yours in 0 degrees Celsius. Any way you try to walk it back is just that. I’m not missing the point, you’ve changed the point now that you’re being downvoted for this obviously false equivalency.
    - thebruce87m 3y ago
      I’ve explained my point in two different ways. My point was related to Tesla stories being amplified. I can’t give an anecdote about -40C temperatures since I don’t experience those in my country. I don’t know why I’m being downvoted, maybe there are other people like you determined to interpret it the wrong way.