3 ms·

> I won’t be surprised if in 30 years it is extremely difficult to _buy_ (legally) music. When was ever feasible to legally buy music? I mean for the average J

> I won’t be surprised if in 30 years it is extremely difficult to _buy_ (legally) music. When was ever feasible to legally buy music? I mean for the average Joe, not a record company or Michael Jackson. It certainly hasn't been in my lifetime, and I'm old by Internet standards. The only thing that has meaningfully changed is that the license period terms have become shorter and shorter.

beeboobaa 3y ago
Too old to remember CDs?
- randomdata 3y ago
  I remember CDs well, but the music on them was never owned, even if Napster tried to make a case otherwise (if you don't know, it failed to make that case, leading to its eventual demise). You're going to have to go back way further, if there was ever a time.
  - ufocia 3y ago
    Back before the Statute of Anne perhaps for games. For music a bit later.
mattdesl 3y ago
Vinyl? CDs? Cassette tapes?
- randomdata 3y ago
  Nope. The music was generally licensed when those were popular. Ownership was retained by the licensor. Maybe in the wax cylinder era ownership of the music was usually passed with the physical media? That is getting to be before my time.
  - s1artibartfast 3y ago
    Interesting question and I did some research on it. (AI results were awful and downright misinformation by the way) Early copyright law didn't explicitly cover music and audio recordings, because the technology did not exist or was not widely available at the time. However, I suspect that they may have been covered by early copyright laws. Copyright Act of 1790 in the United States primarily focused on protecting written works, such as books, maps, and charts, while Early recordings were created in the 1870s. Herbert v. Shanley Co., 242 U.S. 591 (1917), was a United States Supreme Court case in which the Court held hotels and restaurants that perform music must compensate composers, even if the venue is not separately charging patrons to hear the music. From this, I infer that music during this time was copyrightable, so commercial production of it via wax cylinder would also be infringement. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_v._Shanley_Co https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_v._Shanley_Co.
    - ufocia 3y ago
      Look up the Statue of Anne.
s1artibartfast 3y ago
fair but pedantic point. Even with CDs, you were never buying the "music". You were buying a durable physical copy of it and rights to use it within some defined contexts. Buying a CD never entitled you to reproduction for sale, or most commercial use like soundtrack to a box-office movie.

beeboobaa 3y ago

Too old to remember CDs?

randomdata 3y ago
I remember CDs well, but the music on them was never owned, even if Napster tried to make a case otherwise (if you don't know, it failed to make that case, leading to its eventual demise). You're going to have to go back way further, if there was ever a time.
- ufocia 3y ago
  Back before the Statute of Anne perhaps for games. For music a bit later.

mattdesl 3y ago

Vinyl? CDs? Cassette tapes?

randomdata 3y ago
Nope. The music was generally licensed when those were popular. Ownership was retained by the licensor. Maybe in the wax cylinder era ownership of the music was usually passed with the physical media? That is getting to be before my time.
- s1artibartfast 3y ago
  Interesting question and I did some research on it. (AI results were awful and downright misinformation by the way) Early copyright law didn't explicitly cover music and audio recordings, because the technology did not exist or was not widely available at the time. However, I suspect that they may have been covered by early copyright laws. Copyright Act of 1790 in the United States primarily focused on protecting written works, such as books, maps, and charts, while Early recordings were created in the 1870s. Herbert v. Shanley Co., 242 U.S. 591 (1917), was a United States Supreme Court case in which the Court held hotels and restaurants that perform music must compensate composers, even if the venue is not separately charging patrons to hear the music. From this, I infer that music during this time was copyrightable, so commercial production of it via wax cylinder would also be infringement. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_v._Shanley_Co https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_v._Shanley_Co.
  - ufocia 3y ago
    Look up the Statue of Anne.

s1artibartfast 3y ago

fair but pedantic point. Even with CDs, you were never buying the "music". You were buying a durable physical copy of it and rights to use it within some defined contexts. Buying a CD never entitled you to reproduction for sale, or most commercial use like soundtrack to a box-office movie.