5 ms·

What happens to science when the most talented kids won't be able to compete in ~2 years tops? Would our civilization reach plateau or start downward trajectory

What happens to science when the most talented kids won't be able to compete in ~2 years tops? Would our civilization reach plateau or start downward trajectory as there will be no incentive to torture oneself to become the best in the world? Will it all fade away like chess once computers started beating grandmasters?

Agingcoder 3y ago
I never studied math to become the best in the world !
- treprinum 3y ago
  Are you an Olympiad Gold Medalist? Did you move the field of math significantly (beyond a basic PhD)?
ironlake 3y ago
Chess is immensely more popular since Deep Blue beat Kasparov.
- jstummbillig 3y ago
  True, but the fun is currently derived from humans going up against humans as a sport. Machines are tools (for learning or cheating) but we are not interested in competition with them. How will it work for math, where humans do useful work right now? I can not see battle math becoming a big thing, but maybe when some of the tedious stuff goes away math will be philosophy and poking the smarter system is where entertainment can be had?
- treprinum 3y ago
  Chess was the drosophila of AI - something one could study in detail and invent newer and newer approaches to solving it. It's no longer having that function, was surpassed by Go for a brief moment until that one got solved as well. A whole generation that was raised on this drosophila is slowly fading away, for the new entrants its no longer the game to beat, more like brain stimulating fun exercise/hobby and not something capturing imagination, telling us something about the very base of our intelligence anymore.
EvgeniyZh 3y ago
I don't think chess faded away
jeanloolz 3y ago
Chess never faded away. It actually has never been as big as it is today.
- treprinum 3y ago
  That might be true in the number of active chess players, but it's no longer viewed as a peak intellectual game and the magic is long gone, just another intense hobby some people do, but basic machines can do better.
  - westcoast49 3y ago
    It’a still viewed as a peak intellectual game. And the magic is still there, just watch or listen to the fans of Magnus Carlsen when they’re viewing, discussing or analyzing his games.
  - mewpmewp2 3y ago
    Maybe not the peak intellectual game, because there are overall so many other games, digital as well, but it is unaffected from the fact that computers have beat humans.
lacker 3y ago
The incentive to compete in the IMO is that it's fun to do math contests, it's fun to win math contests, and (if you think that far ahead as a high schooler) it looks good on your resume. None of that incentive will go away if the computers get better at math contests.
- treprinum 3y ago
  I'd be super demoralized if anything I could do a future pocket machine could do much better and faster. Like my very best is not enough to even tread water.
  - gowld 3y ago
    That applies to most things humans so for fun. No one needs these contest math problems solved -- by requirement, they are solved before any student attempts them.
- jhbadger 3y ago
  People still compete in foot races even though cars can go faster. People still play chess and Go even though computers can beat them.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
sdenton4 3y ago
We just need a Netflix series about a geometry prodigy with excellent fashion sense.
hiAndrewQuinn 3y ago
I've accepted that the human form, with its ~3 pounds of not especially optimized brainpower, is basically going to be relegated to the same status as demoscene hardware for anything that matters after this century. That's cool by me, though. This bit of demoscene hardware experiences qualia, and that combination is weird and cool enough to make me want to push myself in new and weird directions. That's what play is in a way.
imranq 3y ago
Unless you can figure out AI that is available everywhere, all the time (even in the most remote jungle with no power), there will always be value in making humans smarter
WalterSear 3y ago
The same thing that happened when they allowed calculators in the classroom.

Agingcoder 3y ago

I never studied math to become the best in the world !

treprinum 3y ago
Are you an Olympiad Gold Medalist? Did you move the field of math significantly (beyond a basic PhD)?

ironlake 3y ago

Chess is immensely more popular since Deep Blue beat Kasparov.

jstummbillig 3y ago
True, but the fun is currently derived from humans going up against humans as a sport. Machines are tools (for learning or cheating) but we are not interested in competition with them. How will it work for math, where humans do useful work right now? I can not see battle math becoming a big thing, but maybe when some of the tedious stuff goes away math will be philosophy and poking the smarter system is where entertainment can be had?
treprinum 3y ago
Chess was the drosophila of AI - something one could study in detail and invent newer and newer approaches to solving it. It's no longer having that function, was surpassed by Go for a brief moment until that one got solved as well. A whole generation that was raised on this drosophila is slowly fading away, for the new entrants its no longer the game to beat, more like brain stimulating fun exercise/hobby and not something capturing imagination, telling us something about the very base of our intelligence anymore.

EvgeniyZh 3y ago

I don't think chess faded away

jeanloolz 3y ago

Chess never faded away. It actually has never been as big as it is today.

treprinum 3y ago
That might be true in the number of active chess players, but it's no longer viewed as a peak intellectual game and the magic is long gone, just another intense hobby some people do, but basic machines can do better.
- westcoast49 3y ago
  It’a still viewed as a peak intellectual game. And the magic is still there, just watch or listen to the fans of Magnus Carlsen when they’re viewing, discussing or analyzing his games.
- mewpmewp2 3y ago
  Maybe not the peak intellectual game, because there are overall so many other games, digital as well, but it is unaffected from the fact that computers have beat humans.

lacker 3y ago

The incentive to compete in the IMO is that it's fun to do math contests, it's fun to win math contests, and (if you think that far ahead as a high schooler) it looks good on your resume. None of that incentive will go away if the computers get better at math contests.

treprinum 3y ago
I'd be super demoralized if anything I could do a future pocket machine could do much better and faster. Like my very best is not enough to even tread water.
- gowld 3y ago
  That applies to most things humans so for fun. No one needs these contest math problems solved -- by requirement, they are solved before any student attempts them.
jhbadger 3y ago
People still compete in foot races even though cars can go faster. People still play chess and Go even though computers can beat them.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

sdenton4 3y ago

We just need a Netflix series about a geometry prodigy with excellent fashion sense.

hiAndrewQuinn 3y ago

I've accepted that the human form, with its ~3 pounds of not especially optimized brainpower, is basically going to be relegated to the same status as demoscene hardware for anything that matters after this century. That's cool by me, though. This bit of demoscene hardware experiences qualia, and that combination is weird and cool enough to make me want to push myself in new and weird directions. That's what play is in a way.

imranq 3y ago

Unless you can figure out AI that is available everywhere, all the time (even in the most remote jungle with no power), there will always be value in making humans smarter

WalterSear 3y ago

The same thing that happened when they allowed calculators in the classroom.