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Vulkan only getting a mesh shader API a year ago when Nvidia shipped hardware in 2018 is a joke. I want Vulkan to be great, but it's painfully obvious it's beh

Vulkan only getting a mesh shader API a year ago when Nvidia shipped hardware in 2018 is a joke. I want Vulkan to be great, but it's painfully obvious it's behind.

samus 3y ago
Khronos is inherently unable to be ahead since it is a consortium of vendors with stakes in computer graphics. Khronos APIs are standardizations and/or abstractions on top of the platform-specific APIs, and new APIs and features usually start out as vendor extensions. They get standardized only when they get stabilized and adopted by other vendors. This is exactly what happened with mesh shaders - nVidia shipped the first hardware, but the extensions could rightfully not be uplifted to a standard API before other vendors also delivered implementations, as that could inconvenience their efforts.
- ladyanita22 3y ago
  Vendor-specific extensions exist.
  - pjmlp 3y ago
    They do indeed, Vulkan is getting them at higher pace than OpenGL, I hope there is some sauce for that spaghetti. https://vulkan.gpuinfo.org/listextensions.php https://vulkan.gpuinfo.org/listextensions.php
  - samus 3y ago
    Yes, and a lot of them introduce features that only later get later standardized into core extensions. Some of them remain proprietary, but it's still useful to have them in Vulkan so that they can be used in special circumstances.
pjmlp 3y ago
Don't hold your breath regarding Direct Storage like capabilities, or work graphs. It has been the same following DirectX lead, from GPU vendors collaboration with Microsoft, and extensions spaghetti as OpenGL. Additionally it seems GLSL is stagnant, and from 2023's panel the suggestion was to adopt HLSL instead as there is no budget for language research.
- ladyanita22 3y ago
  Proton already supports DirectStorage.
  - pjmlp 3y ago
    Of course it does, have to keep that Windows emulation going for Windows games on GNU/Linux.
    - ladyanita22 3y ago
      That's not relevant. It runs VK as a backend. If it runs in Proton, it's because either Linux or Vulkan let's you do it natively.

Vulkan only getting a mesh shader API a year ago when Nvidia shipped hardware in 2018 is a joke. I want Vulkan to be great, but it's painfully obvious it's behind.

samus 3y ago

Khronos is inherently unable to be ahead since it is a consortium of vendors with stakes in computer graphics. Khronos APIs are standardizations and/or abstractions on top of the platform-specific APIs, and new APIs and features usually start out as vendor extensions. They get standardized only when they get stabilized and adopted by other vendors. This is exactly what happened with mesh shaders - nVidia shipped the first hardware, but the extensions could rightfully not be uplifted to a standard API before other vendors also delivered implementations, as that could inconvenience their efforts.

ladyanita22 3y ago
Vendor-specific extensions exist.
- pjmlp 3y ago
  They do indeed, Vulkan is getting them at higher pace than OpenGL, I hope there is some sauce for that spaghetti. https://vulkan.gpuinfo.org/listextensions.php https://vulkan.gpuinfo.org/listextensions.php
- samus 3y ago
  Yes, and a lot of them introduce features that only later get later standardized into core extensions. Some of them remain proprietary, but it's still useful to have them in Vulkan so that they can be used in special circumstances.

pjmlp 3y ago

Don't hold your breath regarding Direct Storage like capabilities, or work graphs. It has been the same following DirectX lead, from GPU vendors collaboration with Microsoft, and extensions spaghetti as OpenGL. Additionally it seems GLSL is stagnant, and from 2023's panel the suggestion was to adopt HLSL instead as there is no budget for language research.

ladyanita22 3y ago
Proton already supports DirectStorage.
- pjmlp 3y ago
  Of course it does, have to keep that Windows emulation going for Windows games on GNU/Linux.
  - ladyanita22 3y ago
    That's not relevant. It runs VK as a backend. If it runs in Proton, it's because either Linux or Vulkan let's you do it natively.