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There are tens of millions [1] of App Store developers you will need to coordinate. Where you think of organising a rally or just an email campaign ? [1] http

There are tens of millions [1] of App Store developers you will need to coordinate. Where you think of organising a rally or just an email campaign ? [1] https://www.theverge.com/2023/5/19/23730302/apple-app-store-transparency-report-2022# https://www.theverge.com/2023/5/19/23730302/apple-app-store-...

jacquesm 3y ago
In the age of the internet I think reaching tens of millions of individuals is not as hard as it used to be. A Reddit post announcing a boycott of the App store by a few hundred or a few thousand initial App developers with enough lead time for the message to spread would be a fine starting point. I'm sure it would be all over the globe by morning. I just posited the idea here in NL at 2:30 in the morning and you, somewhere else entirely have already heard of it. That mechanism could be vastly improved upon but I think the principle is sound as your average cat meme has proven thousands of times by now.
- BadHumans 3y ago
  You should get started on organizing it and let us know how it goes.
  - jacquesm 3y ago
    My solution is much simpler: I've opted out of all App eco systems entirely because I think Google and Apple already have enough power as it is. My software is free, free to download and free to run.
- ericmay 3y ago
  I'm not convinced that this would result in lower prices for me as a customer. The current prices that work for a company to stay in business and make a nice profit (think anyone from Netflix, to whoever makes Clash of Clans) show that there is a willingness to pay those prices. If a developer union of sorts succeeds in negotiating down Apple's charge, there is absolutely 0 chance that this cost savings will make its way on the whole to consumers precisely because developers have already proven that customers are willing to take a higher price. As an end customer I think it's a good thing if an indie developers get more money in the abstract. I don't think I care if it means that Netflix gets to keep more of their money instead of Apple. I'm much more sympathetic toward lower fees for smaller companies. Once you are the size of Meta, Google, Apple, Amazon, Netflix, Spotify, etc. it's just jostling between multi-billion (trillion) companies and I'm not really concerned one way or the other, especially if these actions result in more annoying behavior that I have to deal with, like multiple app stores, increase in spam and ads and spying, and the dissolution of the power of features like Sign in with Apple that allow me to generate fake email addresses.
  - k8svet 3y ago
    Ah yes, this again. "We can only have nice things because of the golden handcuffs Apple has blessed us with!". Except that there's plenty of counter examples. And you might not care, but thousands of independent app developers getting bent over the barrel by Apple certainly care. In my view, it's not even really about the end consumer price.
  - jacquesm 3y ago
    > I'm not convinced that this would result in lower prices for me as a customer. That's perfectly ok because that's not the intended effect, the intended effect is to stop Apple/Google from exacting a 30% toll on their platforms, not to improve consumer prices. > I'm much more sympathetic toward lower fees for smaller companies. This already exists.
    - ericmay 3y ago
      It’s ok - so it’s neutral… but then I have to deal with annoying things like multiple app stores and so now it’s just a net negative…
      - nirvdrum 3y ago
        I don’t think you’d be required to use alternative app stores. You could keep using the Apple one if you wanted. Market forces should allow the best store to win. Having another “store” doesn’t necessarily mean having to get apps elsewhere. E.g., the one platform app store has severely degraded my ability to enjoy audiobooks. I used to be able to buy books directly in Audible (on Android anyway). It was convenient and Audible offered daily deals. I’d get books on a whim and discover new authors that way. Once Audible had to start paying a 30% tax, that feature went away. Now I have to browse & purchase in a web browser, which is far less convenient. Incidentally, both Apple and Google sell audiobooks. Presumably they aren’t paying a 30% tax themselves and can use that as a builtin price advantage. But, then I’m tied to that platform. In this case, you'd be making an "in-app purchase" with your Amazon account. There's no new annoyance in payment management and there's no new store to browse. You just get a more convenient way to buy content.
k8svet 3y ago
Ah yes, better that we throw our hands up in the air, declare it unsolvable and acquiesce to big tech.
- jacquesm 3y ago
  It's much worse than that, they're actively enabling all of this.
  - threeseed 3y ago
    That's a great approach to convince developers to get on board with your strike. This is all their fault.
    - jacquesm 3y ago
      It is. I'm not an App store developer for a reason. There is no way that you can get me to carry water for Apple or Google by putting them in between the users of my work and me. Ditto Microsoft. And I'm perfectly ok with App store developers doing what they are doing and making lots of money. But there is a price tag and they either must be ok with that or like me they'd opt-out. So I've been 'striking' for as long as I've had App ideas and things that I could have fielded as an App but ended up just putting on the web. I don't need to convince anybody.

jacquesm 3y ago

In the age of the internet I think reaching tens of millions of individuals is not as hard as it used to be. A Reddit post announcing a boycott of the App store by a few hundred or a few thousand initial App developers with enough lead time for the message to spread would be a fine starting point. I'm sure it would be all over the globe by morning. I just posited the idea here in NL at 2:30 in the morning and you, somewhere else entirely have already heard of it. That mechanism could be vastly improved upon but I think the principle is sound as your average cat meme has proven thousands of times by now.

BadHumans 3y ago
You should get started on organizing it and let us know how it goes.
- jacquesm 3y ago
  My solution is much simpler: I've opted out of all App eco systems entirely because I think Google and Apple already have enough power as it is. My software is free, free to download and free to run.
ericmay 3y ago
I'm not convinced that this would result in lower prices for me as a customer. The current prices that work for a company to stay in business and make a nice profit (think anyone from Netflix, to whoever makes Clash of Clans) show that there is a willingness to pay those prices. If a developer union of sorts succeeds in negotiating down Apple's charge, there is absolutely 0 chance that this cost savings will make its way on the whole to consumers precisely because developers have already proven that customers are willing to take a higher price. As an end customer I think it's a good thing if an indie developers get more money in the abstract. I don't think I care if it means that Netflix gets to keep more of their money instead of Apple. I'm much more sympathetic toward lower fees for smaller companies. Once you are the size of Meta, Google, Apple, Amazon, Netflix, Spotify, etc. it's just jostling between multi-billion (trillion) companies and I'm not really concerned one way or the other, especially if these actions result in more annoying behavior that I have to deal with, like multiple app stores, increase in spam and ads and spying, and the dissolution of the power of features like Sign in with Apple that allow me to generate fake email addresses.
- k8svet 3y ago
  Ah yes, this again. "We can only have nice things because of the golden handcuffs Apple has blessed us with!". Except that there's plenty of counter examples. And you might not care, but thousands of independent app developers getting bent over the barrel by Apple certainly care. In my view, it's not even really about the end consumer price.
- jacquesm 3y ago
  > I'm not convinced that this would result in lower prices for me as a customer. That's perfectly ok because that's not the intended effect, the intended effect is to stop Apple/Google from exacting a 30% toll on their platforms, not to improve consumer prices. > I'm much more sympathetic toward lower fees for smaller companies. This already exists.
  - ericmay 3y ago
    It’s ok - so it’s neutral… but then I have to deal with annoying things like multiple app stores and so now it’s just a net negative…
    - nirvdrum 3y ago
      I don’t think you’d be required to use alternative app stores. You could keep using the Apple one if you wanted. Market forces should allow the best store to win. Having another “store” doesn’t necessarily mean having to get apps elsewhere. E.g., the one platform app store has severely degraded my ability to enjoy audiobooks. I used to be able to buy books directly in Audible (on Android anyway). It was convenient and Audible offered daily deals. I’d get books on a whim and discover new authors that way. Once Audible had to start paying a 30% tax, that feature went away. Now I have to browse & purchase in a web browser, which is far less convenient. Incidentally, both Apple and Google sell audiobooks. Presumably they aren’t paying a 30% tax themselves and can use that as a builtin price advantage. But, then I’m tied to that platform. In this case, you'd be making an "in-app purchase" with your Amazon account. There's no new annoyance in payment management and there's no new store to browse. You just get a more convenient way to buy content.

k8svet 3y ago

Ah yes, better that we throw our hands up in the air, declare it unsolvable and acquiesce to big tech.

jacquesm 3y ago
It's much worse than that, they're actively enabling all of this.
- threeseed 3y ago
  That's a great approach to convince developers to get on board with your strike. This is all their fault.
  - jacquesm 3y ago
    It is. I'm not an App store developer for a reason. There is no way that you can get me to carry water for Apple or Google by putting them in between the users of my work and me. Ditto Microsoft. And I'm perfectly ok with App store developers doing what they are doing and making lots of money. But there is a price tag and they either must be ok with that or like me they'd opt-out. So I've been 'striking' for as long as I've had App ideas and things that I could have fielded as an App but ended up just putting on the web. I don't need to convince anybody.