5 ms·

Should You Do A Startup? I Have No Idea

62 points by diego 14y ago

flavien_bessede 14y ago
"Do, or do not. There is no 'try.'"
- diego 14y ago
  About it tell me. Unless rugby you're playing.
tdr 14y ago
I think the idea behind "don't do a startup" is to warn and discourage people that want to do it because it's cool. The fundamentals behind starting a startup should be orders of magnitude stronger than that. You'll know if you got them. While I think the startup experience should be tried by anyone (and by the way, I don't think startup life sucks, but it is hard), I hope it won't turn into an international trend where every "social" site equals a multi-million $ business.
- diego 14y ago
  By the same token, why bother discouraging people? It's the same as saying "stay in school, don't do drugs. Don't try to be a rockstar like me." There's only so much need for startups and so much money to go around. To me, the original article was just an excuse for this guy to "humblebrag."
  - tdr 14y ago
    That's why I said it should be tried by everybody: you learn a lot. Most likely "the hard way". But nothing good can come out when people jump into it without a proper preparation & plan.
tferris 14y ago
The reasons doing a startup are totally irrelevant. For some it's money, for other power, status, passion or whatever. It's not important why you do a startup. These are just drivers and they are good because they push you to start—push you beyond your boundaries. Are these the right reasons? Nobody cares. It's important just to do something, to start and to carry on. Even if it will get very hard it's the most satisfying experience you'll never regret—you learn, you do, you make decisions. Looking back every single day I spent as an employee was a waste of time.
- sparknlaunch12 14y ago
  Slightly disagree. Yes, doing a startup for the wrong reasons is totally reckless and will end in tears. Chasing money and fame its a recipe for failure. However taking the risk on startup without a reason or purpose will equally end badly. Starting a startup is hard therefore you need to accept reality and pursue a purposeful reason.
  - tferris 14y ago
    Even if you do a startup for 'wrong' reasons like chasing money and fame at least you did something, hell you learned something and made mistakes. That's what's all about! What's the alternative? Staying employed and missing all your life? It's the experience, it's the way and not the goal. Discussions around doing or not doing a startup are just excuses for oneself to not start something because it's not the right idea, not the right time, not the right co-founders, not the right setup and suddenly these people are 50, missed everything and are full of fear loosing their crappy job.
    - sparknlaunch12 14y ago
      Why cannot one gain the experience by pursuing something for purposeful reasons rather than 'just for the hell of it'? Lessons learned and battle scars are important but why not make it meaningful?
      - 14y ago
sherwin 14y ago
I think the original article (the talk by Phil Libin) was targeted for a more general audience, which qualifies his suggestion not to do a statup. Libin writes: "I’ve narrowed it down, really boiled it down, to one core piece of advice. If I can only say one thing, and I don’t know you any better, it’s: don’t. Don’t do it. Seriously." The key part here is "If I can only say one thing, and I don't know you any better" -- for MOST people, starting your own company is not a good idea! Especially if you'd be doing it for any of the misconceptions that Libin outlines. However, it is odd that Libin chose such an approach given that he was speaking at a conference with a big emphasis on web start ups.
- tferris 14y ago
  Libin chose this topic in order to provoke, to get press and attention for Evernote.
  - Aftershock21 14y ago
    May be he meant as a sarcasm given the success of Evernote!
    - sundeep_b 14y ago
      Sarcasm? Only from that talk, I don't think he has it that much. It felt like he was talking expecting laughs from the audience, but, he was able to get quite a few towards the end.
stephengillie 14y ago
If you have to ask, then the answer is no. If you know the answer is yes, then the answer is yes.
- diego 14y ago
  That's one of those phrases that somehow rings true. However, you may be surprised by the number of "accidental" startup founders who turned out to be successful.
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
jandrewrogers 14y ago
People who genuinely have the psychological characteristics that would make them ideally suited for a startup are unlikely to care if other people think they should do a startup. People that would not do a startup because they are told "don't do a startup" are precisely the people that should not be doing a startup. The details of the argument against doing a startup almost do not matter.
- larrys 14y ago
  I agree with you but it also depends on the particular person and their background also. For example I did a "startup" and succeeded right out of college. But I had always done business things on the side. And I came from a business family. So it was second nature to me when it came time to start something and I had plenty of confidence and it was encouraged by my family (not directly "go do it" but by the lack of negativity.) Had I come from a family of, say, educators or scientists, I don't think it would be the same. Unless of course there was some external reason they were supportive (reading about it or knowing another child of a friend that succeeded or other evidence). Only one example of course but I remember at the time my gf's mother cringing at what I told her I was going to do (after graduating from Wharton no less). If you've traveled the world (I haven't) you are definitely going to feel more comfortable picking up and just going to another foreign city. You feel confident about that even if you, in general, lack confidence. I'm sure I would have more anxiety than you would even with my confidence that might cause me not to take that journey. I do agree with the "told don't do a startup" and listening most likely don't have the personality to overcome many of the obstacles that are involved.
DodgyEggplant 14y ago
One thing I'll tell you: the decision will not be easier next year.
- Estragon 14y ago
  That's interesting. What are you expecting to change?
  - wsc981 14y ago
    I guess what he means is every year you'll be more settled in your current situation. And if things change (getting a steady relation, kids, buying a house, earning more money), the choice is harder to do a start-up.
Schwolop 14y ago
Phil says the only valid reason to do a startup is to "change the world." Phew. I'm doing it for the right reasons after all.
- DavidAbrams 14y ago
  Same. The world's population of rich fuckers will be +1.
DavidAbrams 14y ago
Yeah, I like taking this advice from a company that had no business model, no revenue, and nothing to do with "changing the world."
kamweti 14y ago
it takes two years to start a company http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3110632 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3110632 you can do it too http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBCz9XE57LY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBCz9XE57LY
mryan 14y ago
"As for the ones that have gotten to that sort of scale, it is open for debate whether they've changed the world at all, and, if they have, whether they've done so in a way that is meaningful or has improved the circumstances of mankind." This sums up my problem with the whole 'change the world with your startup' philosophy. What does 'change the world' even mean? It is a fluffy, nebulous term - the startup thinker's equivalent of 'increasing synergy by leveraging strategic partnerships'. If you like that flavour of Kool Aid, great, drink up! Github has changed the world by making it easier to find and share interesting code. Balsamiq has changed the world by making it easier to create mockups. I want to change the world by making it easier to run your own game server [0]. None of these things will go down in history as revolutionary, life-changing ideas at a global scale. But they can improve the lives of a subset of humanity, while letting their owners solve interesting problems and (hopefully) earn a living at the same time. That, to me, is a good enough reason to do a startup. 0 - shameless plug: http://www.cloudfrag.com http://www.cloudfrag.com
tehayj 14y ago
I do startups because I like the challenge and like to show others that I can dominate the system and run things with little effort involved. I dropped out of a regular job in a design company after half a year and will never return to something like that. For me a startup is a challenge to do things better, smarter than established companies.
fara 14y ago
Should you? Indextank was a great product, but the exit was to work for the big boss again.
- diego 14y ago
  It's significantly different though. I can't go into much detail, but being an acquired founder is not the same a being a hired employee.
sundeep_b 14y ago
I too got the same feeling that who is this guy to tell me not to do a startup? Worse, he also says what I should do(go to banking/finance where I can make money or keep collecting paychecks). Hell, I love writing code and building stuff compared to doing banking. So, if I ever earn something, I will try to get it by building something. Thinking again - he's had a successful startup and no doubt a hell lot of people ask him advice and all these points he gave are for those kind of people. Though he didn't highlight it, he said not to do it for the wrong reasons. Right and wrong are sometimes relative, right? Anyways, apart from this advice and he calling the Evernote a second brain, the other info about how he saw confidence in his business and how important it is for customers to stay than pay were really useful. Unfortunately people are talking more about the beginnings than endings. May be he's fed up with a lot of people asking for advice and this is how he publicly declared his answers for such people.
maz29 14y ago
Hey, i'm really interested in reading this but the site is down. Thanks!
lazerwalker 14y ago
When I was considering a career as a musician and actor in middle school and high school, there's a piece of advice I was given many, many times by my mentors and teachers: "Only pursue a career in the performing arts if you can't see yourself being happy doing anything else. It's hard. You will face countless rejections, and even after that you'll most likely never make it big. But if you can't see yourself being happy do anything else, go for it." If you think you could be just as happy working for a large company, you should probably go do so. Entrepreneurship is tough, and if you can find satisfaction from a job that doesn't have the monumental downsides that doing a startup does, you're probably better off steering clear. If that's not the case, and if for whatever reason you can't imagine yourself working anywhere other than a startup, do it. Don't feel like you need to tell people that they're doing it for the wrong reasons, or that you need to justify your own reasoning to those sorts of people.

62 points by diego 14y ago

flavien_bessede 14y ago

"Do, or do not. There is no 'try.'"

diego 14y ago
About it tell me. Unless rugby you're playing.

tdr 14y ago

I think the idea behind "don't do a startup" is to warn and discourage people that want to do it because it's cool. The fundamentals behind starting a startup should be orders of magnitude stronger than that. You'll know if you got them. While I think the startup experience should be tried by anyone (and by the way, I don't think startup life sucks, but it is hard), I hope it won't turn into an international trend where every "social" site equals a multi-million $ business.

diego 14y ago
By the same token, why bother discouraging people? It's the same as saying "stay in school, don't do drugs. Don't try to be a rockstar like me." There's only so much need for startups and so much money to go around. To me, the original article was just an excuse for this guy to "humblebrag."
- tdr 14y ago
  That's why I said it should be tried by everybody: you learn a lot. Most likely "the hard way". But nothing good can come out when people jump into it without a proper preparation & plan.

tferris 14y ago

The reasons doing a startup are totally irrelevant. For some it's money, for other power, status, passion or whatever. It's not important why you do a startup. These are just drivers and they are good because they push you to start—push you beyond your boundaries. Are these the right reasons? Nobody cares. It's important just to do something, to start and to carry on. Even if it will get very hard it's the most satisfying experience you'll never regret—you learn, you do, you make decisions. Looking back every single day I spent as an employee was a waste of time.

sparknlaunch12 14y ago
Slightly disagree. Yes, doing a startup for the wrong reasons is totally reckless and will end in tears. Chasing money and fame its a recipe for failure. However taking the risk on startup without a reason or purpose will equally end badly. Starting a startup is hard therefore you need to accept reality and pursue a purposeful reason.
- tferris 14y ago
  Even if you do a startup for 'wrong' reasons like chasing money and fame at least you did something, hell you learned something and made mistakes. That's what's all about! What's the alternative? Staying employed and missing all your life? It's the experience, it's the way and not the goal. Discussions around doing or not doing a startup are just excuses for oneself to not start something because it's not the right idea, not the right time, not the right co-founders, not the right setup and suddenly these people are 50, missed everything and are full of fear loosing their crappy job.
  - sparknlaunch12 14y ago
    Why cannot one gain the experience by pursuing something for purposeful reasons rather than 'just for the hell of it'? Lessons learned and battle scars are important but why not make it meaningful?
    - 14y ago

sherwin 14y ago

I think the original article (the talk by Phil Libin) was targeted for a more general audience, which qualifies his suggestion not to do a statup. Libin writes: "I’ve narrowed it down, really boiled it down, to one core piece of advice. If I can only say one thing, and I don’t know you any better, it’s: don’t. Don’t do it. Seriously." The key part here is "If I can only say one thing, and I don't know you any better" -- for MOST people, starting your own company is not a good idea! Especially if you'd be doing it for any of the misconceptions that Libin outlines. However, it is odd that Libin chose such an approach given that he was speaking at a conference with a big emphasis on web start ups.

tferris 14y ago
Libin chose this topic in order to provoke, to get press and attention for Evernote.
- Aftershock21 14y ago
  May be he meant as a sarcasm given the success of Evernote!
  - sundeep_b 14y ago
    Sarcasm? Only from that talk, I don't think he has it that much. It felt like he was talking expecting laughs from the audience, but, he was able to get quite a few towards the end.

stephengillie 14y ago

If you have to ask, then the answer is no. If you know the answer is yes, then the answer is yes.

diego 14y ago
That's one of those phrases that somehow rings true. However, you may be surprised by the number of "accidental" startup founders who turned out to be successful.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]

jandrewrogers 14y ago

People who genuinely have the psychological characteristics that would make them ideally suited for a startup are unlikely to care if other people think they should do a startup. People that would not do a startup because they are told "don't do a startup" are precisely the people that should not be doing a startup. The details of the argument against doing a startup almost do not matter.

larrys 14y ago
I agree with you but it also depends on the particular person and their background also. For example I did a "startup" and succeeded right out of college. But I had always done business things on the side. And I came from a business family. So it was second nature to me when it came time to start something and I had plenty of confidence and it was encouraged by my family (not directly "go do it" but by the lack of negativity.) Had I come from a family of, say, educators or scientists, I don't think it would be the same. Unless of course there was some external reason they were supportive (reading about it or knowing another child of a friend that succeeded or other evidence). Only one example of course but I remember at the time my gf's mother cringing at what I told her I was going to do (after graduating from Wharton no less). If you've traveled the world (I haven't) you are definitely going to feel more comfortable picking up and just going to another foreign city. You feel confident about that even if you, in general, lack confidence. I'm sure I would have more anxiety than you would even with my confidence that might cause me not to take that journey. I do agree with the "told don't do a startup" and listening most likely don't have the personality to overcome many of the obstacles that are involved.

DodgyEggplant 14y ago

One thing I'll tell you: the decision will not be easier next year.

Estragon 14y ago
That's interesting. What are you expecting to change?
- wsc981 14y ago
  I guess what he means is every year you'll be more settled in your current situation. And if things change (getting a steady relation, kids, buying a house, earning more money), the choice is harder to do a start-up.

Schwolop 14y ago

Phil says the only valid reason to do a startup is to "change the world." Phew. I'm doing it for the right reasons after all.

DavidAbrams 14y ago
Same. The world's population of rich fuckers will be +1.

DavidAbrams 14y ago

Yeah, I like taking this advice from a company that had no business model, no revenue, and nothing to do with "changing the world."

kamweti 14y ago

it takes two years to start a company http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3110632 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3110632 you can do it too http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBCz9XE57LY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBCz9XE57LY

mryan 14y ago

"As for the ones that have gotten to that sort of scale, it is open for debate whether they've changed the world at all, and, if they have, whether they've done so in a way that is meaningful or has improved the circumstances of mankind." This sums up my problem with the whole 'change the world with your startup' philosophy. What does 'change the world' even mean? It is a fluffy, nebulous term - the startup thinker's equivalent of 'increasing synergy by leveraging strategic partnerships'. If you like that flavour of Kool Aid, great, drink up! Github has changed the world by making it easier to find and share interesting code. Balsamiq has changed the world by making it easier to create mockups. I want to change the world by making it easier to run your own game server [0]. None of these things will go down in history as revolutionary, life-changing ideas at a global scale. But they can improve the lives of a subset of humanity, while letting their owners solve interesting problems and (hopefully) earn a living at the same time. That, to me, is a good enough reason to do a startup. 0 - shameless plug: http://www.cloudfrag.com http://www.cloudfrag.com

tehayj 14y ago

I do startups because I like the challenge and like to show others that I can dominate the system and run things with little effort involved. I dropped out of a regular job in a design company after half a year and will never return to something like that. For me a startup is a challenge to do things better, smarter than established companies.

fara 14y ago

Should you? Indextank was a great product, but the exit was to work for the big boss again.

diego 14y ago
It's significantly different though. I can't go into much detail, but being an acquired founder is not the same a being a hired employee.

sundeep_b 14y ago

I too got the same feeling that who is this guy to tell me not to do a startup? Worse, he also says what I should do(go to banking/finance where I can make money or keep collecting paychecks). Hell, I love writing code and building stuff compared to doing banking. So, if I ever earn something, I will try to get it by building something. Thinking again - he's had a successful startup and no doubt a hell lot of people ask him advice and all these points he gave are for those kind of people. Though he didn't highlight it, he said not to do it for the wrong reasons. Right and wrong are sometimes relative, right? Anyways, apart from this advice and he calling the Evernote a second brain, the other info about how he saw confidence in his business and how important it is for customers to stay than pay were really useful. Unfortunately people are talking more about the beginnings than endings. May be he's fed up with a lot of people asking for advice and this is how he publicly declared his answers for such people.

maz29 14y ago

Hey, i'm really interested in reading this but the site is down. Thanks!

lazerwalker 14y ago

When I was considering a career as a musician and actor in middle school and high school, there's a piece of advice I was given many, many times by my mentors and teachers: "Only pursue a career in the performing arts if you can't see yourself being happy doing anything else. It's hard. You will face countless rejections, and even after that you'll most likely never make it big. But if you can't see yourself being happy do anything else, go for it." If you think you could be just as happy working for a large company, you should probably go do so. Entrepreneurship is tough, and if you can find satisfaction from a job that doesn't have the monumental downsides that doing a startup does, you're probably better off steering clear. If that's not the case, and if for whatever reason you can't imagine yourself working anywhere other than a startup, do it. Don't feel like you need to tell people that they're doing it for the wrong reasons, or that you need to justify your own reasoning to those sorts of people.