5 ms·

TinyML is like IoT: great on concepts, everyone agrees it's the future, but has been slow to take off. or, maybe it's just that they're being built into all pr

TinyML is like IoT: great on concepts, everyone agrees it's the future, but has been slow to take off. or, maybe it's just that they're being built into all products now, they just do not need the brand for them such as IoT or TinyML.

modeless 3y ago
I don't agree that TinyML is the future, just as I don't think IoT is the future. The future is robot servants. They will be ~human scale and have plenty of power to run regular big ML. In fact, I hope my home has fewer smart devices in the future. I don't need an electronic door lock if my robot butler unlocks the door when I get home. I don't need smart window shades if the butler opens and closes them whenever I want. I don't need a dishwasher or bread maker or Cuisinart or whatever other labor saving device if I don't need to save labor anymore. Labor will be practically free.
- synergy20 3y ago
  I consider tinyml is like an ant or a spider, it's tiny, but intelligent enough to do its own inference to survive. not all insects and animals need plenty of power to exist, so do AI agents, so yes TinyML has its places, in fact maybe way more than where the powerful AI agents are needed.
  - bethekind 3y ago
    I've heard mummerings that AI might best be used in a swarm/hivemind aspect, so the comparison of AI to an ant/spider is intriguing.
- oytis 3y ago
  If labor is free, what are you going to pay for a servant robot with? Why would robots serve useless humans?
  - modeless 3y ago
    "What will humans do in a world where labor is practically free and unlimited" is an interesting question for sure, but getting pretty off topic for this discussion.
- Qwertious 3y ago
  >I don't agree that TinyML is the future, just as I don't think IoT is the future. The future is robot servants. They will be ~human scale and have plenty of power to run regular big ML. I swear I've read an article on exactly why human-scale robot servants make no sense. It's something like: 1. Anything human-scale will tend to weigh as much as a human. That means it needs a lot of batteries, compared to e.g. a roomba. Lots more material and lots more weight means lots more cost. 2. Also, they'll be heavy. Which means if they e.g. fall down the stairs, they could easily kill someone. 3. If they run out of power unexpectedly (e.g. someone blocks their path to the charger) then they'll be a huge pain in the ass to move, because they're human scale. Even moreso if they're on the stairs for some reason.
  - modeless 3y ago
    1. Who cares if it needs a lot of batteries? Batteries aren't that expensive. It'll have a lot less than a car, and people buy cars all the time. The utility of these things will be off the charts and even if they cost more than the average car there will be a big market. People will buy them with financing, like cars. And by doing more things they will reduce the need for other specialized devices like dishwashers, further justifying the cost. 2. Yes, robots will need to be cautious around people, especially children. But if it has a soft cover and compliant joints and good software we should be able to make it safe enough. They will not need to be imposing 7 foot tall giants. I expect they will typically be shorter than the average human. Maybe even child size with built in stilts or other way to reach high things. 3. Extension cord? Swappable auxiliary battery? This seems trivial to solve if it turns out to be a real problem. And if you have two (or borrow your neighbor's) they can help each other out.
  - two_in_one 3y ago
    Just asked the latest gpt preview model to explain why human sized robots make no sense, then why they are the future. In both cases it managed to provide 10 arguments. Some of them are similar, like 'social acceptance' in negative part and 'Sociocultural Acceptance' in positive. PS: it doesn't accept $500 tips anymore ;)
wongarsu 3y ago
If a device is already IoT, that diminishes the value-add of TinyML. Just send all the data home and run inference there, at greater efficiency and with the possibility to find other revenue streams for that data. Or the other way around, if a device uses TinyML there's less reason to make it IoT, and the people who appreciate TinyML are probably exactly those who oppose IoT.
- lakid 3y ago
  what happens if bandwidth is expensive and/or not reliable ? Being able to summarise data and make decisions at the edge without having to consult 'home' every single time is very useful. Perhaps I only want to collect 'interesting' data for anomalous events.
3abiton 3y ago
I disagree, I feel like the applications are limited.

modeless 3y ago

I don't agree that TinyML is the future, just as I don't think IoT is the future. The future is robot servants. They will be ~human scale and have plenty of power to run regular big ML. In fact, I hope my home has fewer smart devices in the future. I don't need an electronic door lock if my robot butler unlocks the door when I get home. I don't need smart window shades if the butler opens and closes them whenever I want. I don't need a dishwasher or bread maker or Cuisinart or whatever other labor saving device if I don't need to save labor anymore. Labor will be practically free.

synergy20 3y ago
I consider tinyml is like an ant or a spider, it's tiny, but intelligent enough to do its own inference to survive. not all insects and animals need plenty of power to exist, so do AI agents, so yes TinyML has its places, in fact maybe way more than where the powerful AI agents are needed.
- bethekind 3y ago
  I've heard mummerings that AI might best be used in a swarm/hivemind aspect, so the comparison of AI to an ant/spider is intriguing.
oytis 3y ago
If labor is free, what are you going to pay for a servant robot with? Why would robots serve useless humans?
- modeless 3y ago
  "What will humans do in a world where labor is practically free and unlimited" is an interesting question for sure, but getting pretty off topic for this discussion.
Qwertious 3y ago
>I don't agree that TinyML is the future, just as I don't think IoT is the future. The future is robot servants. They will be ~human scale and have plenty of power to run regular big ML. I swear I've read an article on exactly why human-scale robot servants make no sense. It's something like: 1. Anything human-scale will tend to weigh as much as a human. That means it needs a lot of batteries, compared to e.g. a roomba. Lots more material and lots more weight means lots more cost. 2. Also, they'll be heavy. Which means if they e.g. fall down the stairs, they could easily kill someone. 3. If they run out of power unexpectedly (e.g. someone blocks their path to the charger) then they'll be a huge pain in the ass to move, because they're human scale. Even moreso if they're on the stairs for some reason.
- modeless 3y ago
  1. Who cares if it needs a lot of batteries? Batteries aren't that expensive. It'll have a lot less than a car, and people buy cars all the time. The utility of these things will be off the charts and even if they cost more than the average car there will be a big market. People will buy them with financing, like cars. And by doing more things they will reduce the need for other specialized devices like dishwashers, further justifying the cost. 2. Yes, robots will need to be cautious around people, especially children. But if it has a soft cover and compliant joints and good software we should be able to make it safe enough. They will not need to be imposing 7 foot tall giants. I expect they will typically be shorter than the average human. Maybe even child size with built in stilts or other way to reach high things. 3. Extension cord? Swappable auxiliary battery? This seems trivial to solve if it turns out to be a real problem. And if you have two (or borrow your neighbor's) they can help each other out.
- two_in_one 3y ago
  Just asked the latest gpt preview model to explain why human sized robots make no sense, then why they are the future. In both cases it managed to provide 10 arguments. Some of them are similar, like 'social acceptance' in negative part and 'Sociocultural Acceptance' in positive. PS: it doesn't accept $500 tips anymore ;)

wongarsu 3y ago

If a device is already IoT, that diminishes the value-add of TinyML. Just send all the data home and run inference there, at greater efficiency and with the possibility to find other revenue streams for that data. Or the other way around, if a device uses TinyML there's less reason to make it IoT, and the people who appreciate TinyML are probably exactly those who oppose IoT.

lakid 3y ago
what happens if bandwidth is expensive and/or not reliable ? Being able to summarise data and make decisions at the edge without having to consult 'home' every single time is very useful. Perhaps I only want to collect 'interesting' data for anomalous events.

3abiton 3y ago

I disagree, I feel like the applications are limited.