4 ms·

For me the biggest joke is that these people call themselves "software engineers" in the first place.

PakG1 3y ago
The unfortunate reality is that everyone else has accepted that they are software engineers. That unfortunately trumps what "real" software engineers think.
lupusreal 3y ago
You've been downvoted by people who value the word "engineer" in their job title even though they haven't earned it. The title is valued because real engineers have earned a great deal of respect through their diligence, and software "engineers" are for the most part parasites leeching off that respect earned by others.
- spacechild1 3y ago
  Yes. I come from a country where 'engineer' (German: 'Ingenieur') is a title with strict requirements by law. You cannot just call yourself 'engineer' without the appropriate degree or certificates. These people have been called 'software developers' or just 'programmers' back in the day. In fact, I'd argue that most commercial software development is more like plumbing than engineering. Here's a hint: if you're writing control software for airplanes, medical devices or industrial plants, you're an engineer; if you're developing a UI frontend for a website, you're probably not.
  - DaiPlusPlus 3y ago
    What if it’s a UI/frontend for a website that manages a safety-critical system?
    - spacechild1 3y ago
      Then it might be :)
- mlrtime 3y ago
  So what is the difference? Is it a Engineering degree from a credited Engineering school? Or do you just need a PE license?
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- jauer 3y ago
  I downvoted because this sanctification of engineering (guild, not practice) is as tedious as the idea that credentialing is a silver bullet for software quality. I've worked on enough projects with "real engineers" to see that rigor varies significantly with the person. e.g. I've seen a dropout with more engineering rigor than a Waterloo grad (granted, this was at a company with a very selective interview process...) In practice, you do whatever and then pay a licensed PE with an absolutely massive liability insurance policy to stamp your design. If something goes wrong, they take the fall and go sip drinks on a beach somewhere. As usual, incentives rule everything around us.

The unfortunate reality is that everyone else has accepted that they are software engineers. That unfortunately trumps what "real" software engineers think.

lupusreal 3y ago

You've been downvoted by people who value the word "engineer" in their job title even though they haven't earned it. The title is valued because real engineers have earned a great deal of respect through their diligence, and software "engineers" are for the most part parasites leeching off that respect earned by others.

spacechild1 3y ago
Yes. I come from a country where 'engineer' (German: 'Ingenieur') is a title with strict requirements by law. You cannot just call yourself 'engineer' without the appropriate degree or certificates. These people have been called 'software developers' or just 'programmers' back in the day. In fact, I'd argue that most commercial software development is more like plumbing than engineering. Here's a hint: if you're writing control software for airplanes, medical devices or industrial plants, you're an engineer; if you're developing a UI frontend for a website, you're probably not.
- DaiPlusPlus 3y ago
  What if it’s a UI/frontend for a website that manages a safety-critical system?
  - spacechild1 3y ago
    Then it might be :)
mlrtime 3y ago
So what is the difference? Is it a Engineering degree from a credited Engineering school? Or do you just need a PE license?
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
jauer 3y ago
I downvoted because this sanctification of engineering (guild, not practice) is as tedious as the idea that credentialing is a silver bullet for software quality. I've worked on enough projects with "real engineers" to see that rigor varies significantly with the person. e.g. I've seen a dropout with more engineering rigor than a Waterloo grad (granted, this was at a company with a very selective interview process...) In practice, you do whatever and then pay a licensed PE with an absolutely massive liability insurance policy to stamp your design. If something goes wrong, they take the fall and go sip drinks on a beach somewhere. As usual, incentives rule everything around us.