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That's all well and good until your economy stagnates, GDP suffers, and all the vaunted social welfare programs are no longer affordable -- never mind covering

That's all well and good until your economy stagnates, GDP suffers, and all the vaunted social welfare programs are no longer affordable -- never mind covering the staggering actual costs of the EU's own defense against Russia, instead of offloading that cost to the US taxpayer via NATO.

dmitrygr 3y ago
Worry not, there will always be american companies for EU to tax via "fines"
derelicta 3y ago
As long as the economy grows as much as its population, and/or QoL keeps on improving, then I fail to see an issue. Maybe not everything has to grow like a tumor.
- pjlegato 3y ago
  That's the point. The economic growth rate that EU residents demand is NOT supported by its current economic structure and degree of financialization -- hence mass social unrest, which is getting worse every year. The current system cannot continue, one way or another. Sure, the EU could turn into Cuba or North Korea and avoid financialization... but most people will not accept that sort of stagnation in their material conditions. They want a new iPhone, new clothes, new washer, new car, new coffeemaker, holiday in Spain, etc. All that costs money, and ever more money. You also did not address the elephant in the room at all -- most of the costs of keeping the EU from turning into "Russia's westernmost oblast" fall on the taxpayers of the United States via NATO. Avoiding that outcome without what is essentially a large and ongoing annual donation from the financialized United States is not possible, at least without undergoing a similar degree of financialization in the EU. It seems like you wish to enjoy the economic benefits of financialization (new iPhones, not living like Cuba, and also not being conquered by Russia next week) while at the same time morally disparaging those who make those benefits possible.
  - derelicta 3y ago
    Ngl I would root for a posts capitalistic Europe. Also there are reasons for Cuba's current economic stagnation; the US embargo :p

dmitrygr 3y ago

Worry not, there will always be american companies for EU to tax via "fines"

derelicta 3y ago

As long as the economy grows as much as its population, and/or QoL keeps on improving, then I fail to see an issue. Maybe not everything has to grow like a tumor.

pjlegato 3y ago
That's the point. The economic growth rate that EU residents demand is NOT supported by its current economic structure and degree of financialization -- hence mass social unrest, which is getting worse every year. The current system cannot continue, one way or another. Sure, the EU could turn into Cuba or North Korea and avoid financialization... but most people will not accept that sort of stagnation in their material conditions. They want a new iPhone, new clothes, new washer, new car, new coffeemaker, holiday in Spain, etc. All that costs money, and ever more money. You also did not address the elephant in the room at all -- most of the costs of keeping the EU from turning into "Russia's westernmost oblast" fall on the taxpayers of the United States via NATO. Avoiding that outcome without what is essentially a large and ongoing annual donation from the financialized United States is not possible, at least without undergoing a similar degree of financialization in the EU. It seems like you wish to enjoy the economic benefits of financialization (new iPhones, not living like Cuba, and also not being conquered by Russia next week) while at the same time morally disparaging those who make those benefits possible.
- derelicta 3y ago
  Ngl I would root for a posts capitalistic Europe. Also there are reasons for Cuba's current economic stagnation; the US embargo :p