3 ms·

I think this is one of those situations where the optimal strategy for one interaction is very different to that for multiple, iterative interactions. The compa

I think this is one of those situations where the optimal strategy for one interaction is very different to that for multiple, iterative interactions. The company has to presumably hire again in the future, and having a reputation for firing without notice may make it harder to attract the people you want.

tiffanyh 3y ago
You don’t want to give your top talent a reason to look for another job. Telling your top talent a layoff is coming, even if they feel “secure” in their role, still gives them a reason to look. Let alone competitors now have a great pitch to your top talent - “do you want to risk getting laid off or join our awesome company”.
- joeblubaugh 3y ago
  on the other hand, top talent is also likely to feel disrespected by having layoffs sprung on their team with no warning. It was a trigger for 3 of my job changes during my career, each time a "regretted attrition."
throwaway2037 3y ago
"firing without notice": First, not legal in California where most of their highest skilled people work (Emeryville, last that I knew). These people will probably will receive (very) large severance packages worth months of pay. Plenty of time to find a new job. If they are very high skill, it will be easy to find a new role. Also, reputation for an employer is quickly forgotten if salaries are high enough. Please don't forget how many people went to work on dumb projects at the height of Facebook. After the Metaverse was cancelled and many people were laid off, suddenly a bunch of blog posts appeared: "That place was awful to work, but they paid me lots of money." (Example: Eric Lippert) Investment banking is similar. In short, if you pay enough, there are enough (plenty of?) people who don't care about your reputation.
- obmelvin 3y ago
  > "firing without notice": First, not legal in California where most of their highest skilled people work Can you expand? Doesn't at-will meant that you can be fired without advanced notice?
  - throwaway2037 3y ago
    WARN Act: Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification Act of 1988 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worker_Adjustment_and_Retraining_Notification_Act_of_1988 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worker_Adjustment_and_Retraini... Cal-WARN Act https://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/cal-warnact.html https://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/cal-warnact.html
    - obmelvin 3y ago
      Thanks for sharing! I hadn't heard of either of those, so good to know. For anyone reading, the federal act only applies to employers with 100 or more employees and the Cal act requires 75 or more.
- datavirtue 3y ago
  I am so done with "awful but lots of money." I won't even do boring but lots of money any more. I recently took a shocking pay cut to get "not awful and very fun." Being bored was killing me. Draining your soul for money is not wise. Your mind takes on a personality you can't relate to and sinks to an imperceptible malaise. It's a form of torture. Leaving that to discover purpose again is an unforgettable relief. I feel young again and I'm flooded daily with feelings of optimism, something I thought was just lost to youth. Like being released from prison.
  - throwaway2037 3y ago
    > I am so done with "awful but lots of money." I won't even do boring but lots of money any more. This is rich thinking. Most people that I met from developing countries who grew up poor would sell their soul for shitty unfulfilling work that pays huge salary / bonus / stock. I cannot blame them; I would do the same in their situation. I don't pass (too much) judgement on where and why people work. Mostly, it is a luxury to decide when / where / how you work, including for less than the maximum that you can be paid. Personally, my biggest professional problem is that I get bored on a project after two years. It is incredibly rare in my career to stay more than four years on the same project. Yet, time and time again, my managers are surprised when I resign for a new role.

tiffanyh 3y ago

You don’t want to give your top talent a reason to look for another job. Telling your top talent a layoff is coming, even if they feel “secure” in their role, still gives them a reason to look. Let alone competitors now have a great pitch to your top talent - “do you want to risk getting laid off or join our awesome company”.

joeblubaugh 3y ago
on the other hand, top talent is also likely to feel disrespected by having layoffs sprung on their team with no warning. It was a trigger for 3 of my job changes during my career, each time a "regretted attrition."

throwaway2037 3y ago

"firing without notice": First, not legal in California where most of their highest skilled people work (Emeryville, last that I knew). These people will probably will receive (very) large severance packages worth months of pay. Plenty of time to find a new job. If they are very high skill, it will be easy to find a new role. Also, reputation for an employer is quickly forgotten if salaries are high enough. Please don't forget how many people went to work on dumb projects at the height of Facebook. After the Metaverse was cancelled and many people were laid off, suddenly a bunch of blog posts appeared: "That place was awful to work, but they paid me lots of money." (Example: Eric Lippert) Investment banking is similar. In short, if you pay enough, there are enough (plenty of?) people who don't care about your reputation.

obmelvin 3y ago
> "firing without notice": First, not legal in California where most of their highest skilled people work Can you expand? Doesn't at-will meant that you can be fired without advanced notice?
- throwaway2037 3y ago
  WARN Act: Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification Act of 1988 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worker_Adjustment_and_Retraining_Notification_Act_of_1988 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worker_Adjustment_and_Retraini... Cal-WARN Act https://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/cal-warnact.html https://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/cal-warnact.html
  - obmelvin 3y ago
    Thanks for sharing! I hadn't heard of either of those, so good to know. For anyone reading, the federal act only applies to employers with 100 or more employees and the Cal act requires 75 or more.
datavirtue 3y ago
I am so done with "awful but lots of money." I won't even do boring but lots of money any more. I recently took a shocking pay cut to get "not awful and very fun." Being bored was killing me. Draining your soul for money is not wise. Your mind takes on a personality you can't relate to and sinks to an imperceptible malaise. It's a form of torture. Leaving that to discover purpose again is an unforgettable relief. I feel young again and I'm flooded daily with feelings of optimism, something I thought was just lost to youth. Like being released from prison.
- throwaway2037 3y ago
  > I am so done with "awful but lots of money." I won't even do boring but lots of money any more. This is rich thinking. Most people that I met from developing countries who grew up poor would sell their soul for shitty unfulfilling work that pays huge salary / bonus / stock. I cannot blame them; I would do the same in their situation. I don't pass (too much) judgement on where and why people work. Mostly, it is a luxury to decide when / where / how you work, including for less than the maximum that you can be paid. Personally, my biggest professional problem is that I get bored on a project after two years. It is incredibly rare in my career to stay more than four years on the same project. Yet, time and time again, my managers are surprised when I resign for a new role.