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There's just little benefit in HTMX unless you have a live financial dashboard or something like that. I find the opposite approach of local-first (database in

There's just little benefit in HTMX unless you have a live financial dashboard or something like that. I find the opposite approach of local-first (database in the client). It fits more solutions and solves many more things (free offline, syncing, undo support) and getting rid of caching, retries, and latency. Of course the industry wants you to want more on the server though. Same view applies to RSC (react server components). Embrace CRDTs.

recursivedoubts 3y ago
oh, i dunno, seems like the internet has been somewhat successful as a distributed system, but ymmv
- theultdev 3y ago
  centralizing would be using HTMX and authoritative servers. local-first is more decentralized as your clients can sync directly with each other (or through a dumb proxy for NAT punching) I see no need for servers to be anything but dumb proxies for clients. Not the opposite of making clients dumb terminals.
  - recursivedoubts 3y ago
    welp, when you are coordinating things it's often a tremendous simplification to have a centralized source of truth and then present representations of that truth in the form of hypermedia to hypermedia clients, using hypermedia as the engine of application state of course, it's not right for everything and there are alternative approaches that work better or worse, depending on context, but i'd say it's hard to not call it a pretty successful approach to distributed systems
    - theultdev 3y ago
      a centralized source of truth is a pretty successful approach to distributed systems? seems more like a successful escape hatch. yes it's simpler, but it's antithetical to the goal.
      - recursivedoubts 3y ago
        well, i mean, the web is a distributed system of servers providing resource representations specified by universal resource locators it seems to have been fairly successful to me i think you are associating 'distributed' w/peer-to-peer models, whereas i'm using it in the broader sense of networked software that can interact (link) to one another i have no beef w/ peer-to-peer and it would be interesting to think about how hypermedia could layer on top of that model, but i'm not an expert on that sort of stuff so I can't have particularly informed opinions on it

recursivedoubts 3y ago

oh, i dunno, seems like the internet has been somewhat successful as a distributed system, but ymmv

theultdev 3y ago
centralizing would be using HTMX and authoritative servers. local-first is more decentralized as your clients can sync directly with each other (or through a dumb proxy for NAT punching) I see no need for servers to be anything but dumb proxies for clients. Not the opposite of making clients dumb terminals.
- recursivedoubts 3y ago
  welp, when you are coordinating things it's often a tremendous simplification to have a centralized source of truth and then present representations of that truth in the form of hypermedia to hypermedia clients, using hypermedia as the engine of application state of course, it's not right for everything and there are alternative approaches that work better or worse, depending on context, but i'd say it's hard to not call it a pretty successful approach to distributed systems
  - theultdev 3y ago
    a centralized source of truth is a pretty successful approach to distributed systems? seems more like a successful escape hatch. yes it's simpler, but it's antithetical to the goal.
    - recursivedoubts 3y ago
      well, i mean, the web is a distributed system of servers providing resource representations specified by universal resource locators it seems to have been fairly successful to me i think you are associating 'distributed' w/peer-to-peer models, whereas i'm using it in the broader sense of networked software that can interact (link) to one another i have no beef w/ peer-to-peer and it would be interesting to think about how hypermedia could layer on top of that model, but i'm not an expert on that sort of stuff so I can't have particularly informed opinions on it