5 ms·

Torque wrenches don't need a computer at all. More complexity, more chances for things to go wrong. Combine that with Murphy's Law and this is what you get.

KineticLensman 3y ago
How about recording whether Boeing 737 door plug restraining bolts have been correctly torqued?
- CyberDildonics 3y ago
  https://www.amazon.com/ACDelco-ARM601-3-Digital-ft-lbs-Notification/dp/B004VYUQI2 https://www.amazon.com/ACDelco-ARM601-3-Digital-ft-lbs-Notif...
  - kube-system 3y ago
    That one has a computer too, just a more rudimentary one. And rather than entering the number automatically into the relevant records, it relies on the memory of the technician, which also may be error prone.
    - CyberDildonics 3y ago
      It isn't connected to the internet. Also how does the internet connected torque wrench know what bolt it is being used on? If you have different bolts, it wouldn't know. If you have only a single bolt, you could just use a single setting.
      - kube-system 3y ago
        And network-connected wrenches aren't necessarily internet connected either. Back when I worked on critical infrastructure, we had a lot of networked machines that we simply air-gapped from the internet. > Also how does the internet connected torque wrench know what bolt it is being used on? I don't think most of them do, although this has been a focus area of some augmented reality tools. In most cases now, this is a task the technician has to do, regardless of the wrench they are using.
        CyberDildonics 3y ago
        And network-connected wrenches aren't necessarily internet connected either. Back when I worked on critical infrastructure, we had a lot of networked machines that we simply air-gapped from the internet. What I linked isn't connected to a network at all, what is your point here? In most cases now, this is a task the technician has to do, regardless of the wrench they are using. Then how would a network connected torque wrench make sure that airplane bolts are tightened better than a digital torque wrench? I think you're losing track of the context of this thread.
        kube-system 3y ago
        > Then how would a network connected torque wrench make sure that airplane bolts are tightened better than a digital torque wrench? It reduces the potential for human error by automating part of the process and therefore reducing cognitive load and human err. > What I linked isn't connected to a network at all, what is your point here? My point is that you can leverage the advantages of a network connected wrench while also mitigating concerns about internet connectivity by just configuring the network. You don't have to use a tool with fewer features.
        CyberDildonics 3y ago
        It reduces the potential for human error by automating part of the process and therefore reducing cognitive load and human err. What is it automating that a digital torque wrench doesn't? My point is that you can leverage the advantages of a network connected wrench What are the advantages?
        kube-system 3y ago
        That Amazon wrench has no control over the consistency of the torque applied by the user. The user can simply just tighten bolts to any value, at any speed, every single time it is used. The automated wrench does all of the work. The user presses the button and it torques exactly the same, to the spec, every time. Manual torque wrenches are easy to misuse. Multiply that by thousands of bolts and you have a decent probability that you have a couple of bolts that were manually tightened a little too far past the beep, or was torqued too fast and beeped before it was properly torqued. Factories do not spend huge sums of money on automated tooling for no reason. Automation in factories decreases human err and increases the quality and speed of output.
    - userbinator 3y ago
      How about this one: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07SYTQ6FT/ https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07SYTQ6FT/ No computer.
      - kube-system 3y ago
        You are correct, that one doesn't have a computer. It doesn't have many features required by modern industrial processes, though. It isn't suitable for building safety-critical systems.
  - meragrin_ 3y ago
    "Frequently returned item" Not sure if that means there is an issue with it or whether people are just "borrowing" it.
wildzzz 3y ago
I can somewhat understand why these torque wrenches are smart. The screenshot of the software interface showed a flow diagram of the tightening process and it looks like you very precisely describe how the fastener is to be tightened. A normal torque wrench doesn't do that, it's just torque limited and it's up to the user to make sure it's set properly and that the fastener is installed properly. Many torque wrenches can still apply more torque if you keep pulling them. If you require a fastener to be installed exactly the same way every time and to the exact same torque, a smart torque wrench might be required. However, I feel like the wireless feature is not necessary. These wrenches could easily just be plugged into a computer instead that could modify the settings or update the calibration due date or firmware. Tool condition could be displayed on the device and any sort of condition limits could be set to disallow use of the wrench until it's been serviced.
- userbinator 3y ago
  and it's up to the user to make sure it's set properly and that the fastener is installed properly ...and with these "smart" wrenches, it's up to the software developers, network administrators, hardware manufacturers, etc. All of which have to do a good job. People like talking about supply chain attacks these days. A mechanical torque wrench has a much smaller dependency graph and can be easily calibrated and checked with a simple weight and a lever, and can't be programmed to behave subtly different every 12th bolt. These, on the other hand...
JAlexoid 3y ago
Have you ever held a modern power tool?.. Because I very much appreciate the fact that some of my tools will not break my wrist, like the old dumb high power tools like to do.
- mrguyorama 3y ago
  Alright so why does that require a network connection?
  - JAlexoid 3y ago
    I was replying to "Torque wrenches don't need a computer at all." Yes, torque wrenches benefit a lot from a "computer". Neither did the GP say anything about network.

KineticLensman 3y ago

How about recording whether Boeing 737 door plug restraining bolts have been correctly torqued?

CyberDildonics 3y ago
https://www.amazon.com/ACDelco-ARM601-3-Digital-ft-lbs-Notification/dp/B004VYUQI2 https://www.amazon.com/ACDelco-ARM601-3-Digital-ft-lbs-Notif...
- kube-system 3y ago
  That one has a computer too, just a more rudimentary one. And rather than entering the number automatically into the relevant records, it relies on the memory of the technician, which also may be error prone.
  - CyberDildonics 3y ago
    It isn't connected to the internet. Also how does the internet connected torque wrench know what bolt it is being used on? If you have different bolts, it wouldn't know. If you have only a single bolt, you could just use a single setting.
    - kube-system 3y ago
      And network-connected wrenches aren't necessarily internet connected either. Back when I worked on critical infrastructure, we had a lot of networked machines that we simply air-gapped from the internet. > Also how does the internet connected torque wrench know what bolt it is being used on? I don't think most of them do, although this has been a focus area of some augmented reality tools. In most cases now, this is a task the technician has to do, regardless of the wrench they are using.
      - CyberDildonics 3y ago
        And network-connected wrenches aren't necessarily internet connected either. Back when I worked on critical infrastructure, we had a lot of networked machines that we simply air-gapped from the internet. What I linked isn't connected to a network at all, what is your point here? In most cases now, this is a task the technician has to do, regardless of the wrench they are using. Then how would a network connected torque wrench make sure that airplane bolts are tightened better than a digital torque wrench? I think you're losing track of the context of this thread.
        kube-system 3y ago
        > Then how would a network connected torque wrench make sure that airplane bolts are tightened better than a digital torque wrench? It reduces the potential for human error by automating part of the process and therefore reducing cognitive load and human err. > What I linked isn't connected to a network at all, what is your point here? My point is that you can leverage the advantages of a network connected wrench while also mitigating concerns about internet connectivity by just configuring the network. You don't have to use a tool with fewer features.
        CyberDildonics 3y ago
        It reduces the potential for human error by automating part of the process and therefore reducing cognitive load and human err. What is it automating that a digital torque wrench doesn't? My point is that you can leverage the advantages of a network connected wrench What are the advantages?
        kube-system 3y ago
        That Amazon wrench has no control over the consistency of the torque applied by the user. The user can simply just tighten bolts to any value, at any speed, every single time it is used. The automated wrench does all of the work. The user presses the button and it torques exactly the same, to the spec, every time. Manual torque wrenches are easy to misuse. Multiply that by thousands of bolts and you have a decent probability that you have a couple of bolts that were manually tightened a little too far past the beep, or was torqued too fast and beeped before it was properly torqued. Factories do not spend huge sums of money on automated tooling for no reason. Automation in factories decreases human err and increases the quality and speed of output.
  - userbinator 3y ago
    How about this one: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07SYTQ6FT/ https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07SYTQ6FT/ No computer.
    - kube-system 3y ago
      You are correct, that one doesn't have a computer. It doesn't have many features required by modern industrial processes, though. It isn't suitable for building safety-critical systems.
- meragrin_ 3y ago
  "Frequently returned item" Not sure if that means there is an issue with it or whether people are just "borrowing" it.

wildzzz 3y ago

I can somewhat understand why these torque wrenches are smart. The screenshot of the software interface showed a flow diagram of the tightening process and it looks like you very precisely describe how the fastener is to be tightened. A normal torque wrench doesn't do that, it's just torque limited and it's up to the user to make sure it's set properly and that the fastener is installed properly. Many torque wrenches can still apply more torque if you keep pulling them. If you require a fastener to be installed exactly the same way every time and to the exact same torque, a smart torque wrench might be required. However, I feel like the wireless feature is not necessary. These wrenches could easily just be plugged into a computer instead that could modify the settings or update the calibration due date or firmware. Tool condition could be displayed on the device and any sort of condition limits could be set to disallow use of the wrench until it's been serviced.

userbinator 3y ago
and it's up to the user to make sure it's set properly and that the fastener is installed properly ...and with these "smart" wrenches, it's up to the software developers, network administrators, hardware manufacturers, etc. All of which have to do a good job. People like talking about supply chain attacks these days. A mechanical torque wrench has a much smaller dependency graph and can be easily calibrated and checked with a simple weight and a lever, and can't be programmed to behave subtly different every 12th bolt. These, on the other hand...

JAlexoid 3y ago

Have you ever held a modern power tool?.. Because I very much appreciate the fact that some of my tools will not break my wrist, like the old dumb high power tools like to do.

mrguyorama 3y ago
Alright so why does that require a network connection?
- JAlexoid 3y ago
  I was replying to "Torque wrenches don't need a computer at all." Yes, torque wrenches benefit a lot from a "computer". Neither did the GP say anything about network.