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It’s not about lobbying. And it’s far past managing sovereign nations to compromise. Modern EU is a beast of its own and its own interests. Which so far is powe

by mantas 3y ago

It’s not about lobbying. And it’s far past managing sovereign nations to compromise. Modern EU is a beast of its own and its own interests. Which so far is power grab from member states. And trying to push through infamous laws. Such as chat surveillance. The core fact is that EU governance is far removed from the people. It’s too huge and too diverse. But it’s perfect ground for deep state (deep union?) to find ways to work around democratic instruments.

seec 3y ago
Yep, and that's even before mentioning the absurd cost it has for the little real benefits the citizen truly experience. I don't know about the poorer countries in EU, maybe they get net positive benefits; but as far as I can tell, for a country like France, you only get less efficient use of the taxation money, and the outcome are generally disconnected so not necessarily well spent. There is a lot of propaganda around what EU is paying for or allowing. But the truth is that each country would be able to do the exact same thing if they wanted to, just with better money efficiency because it wouldn't have to be cut so much for feeding the bureaucracy monster of the EU...
- mantas 3y ago
  Same here re propaganda. The only difference is we get a lot of your tax money to listen to that propaganda :) But as we catch up economically, we'll get less and less euromonies. And yes, it's terribly inefficient too. The only thing it's efficient at is building a class of people who rely on EU institutions for their wellbeing. Collaborator class if I may?
  - seec 3y ago
    Yes, collaborator is a nice way to put it. I have had the (dis)pleasure of spending a bit of time near Brussels with some people that do "work" tightly related/linked to EU stuff. This is EXACTLY what it feels like; and in most cases it was pretty clear to me that those people cost more money to society than any kind of "value" they were bringing. But the whole thing is politics anyway, so outcomes are kinda irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. To me it looks like a prototype of some sort of new communist system, where the "leaders" choices are completely disconnected from the rest of the population...

by mantas 3y ago

seec 3y ago

Yep, and that's even before mentioning the absurd cost it has for the little real benefits the citizen truly experience. I don't know about the poorer countries in EU, maybe they get net positive benefits; but as far as I can tell, for a country like France, you only get less efficient use of the taxation money, and the outcome are generally disconnected so not necessarily well spent. There is a lot of propaganda around what EU is paying for or allowing. But the truth is that each country would be able to do the exact same thing if they wanted to, just with better money efficiency because it wouldn't have to be cut so much for feeding the bureaucracy monster of the EU...

mantas 3y ago
Same here re propaganda. The only difference is we get a lot of your tax money to listen to that propaganda :) But as we catch up economically, we'll get less and less euromonies. And yes, it's terribly inefficient too. The only thing it's efficient at is building a class of people who rely on EU institutions for their wellbeing. Collaborator class if I may?
- seec 3y ago
  Yes, collaborator is a nice way to put it. I have had the (dis)pleasure of spending a bit of time near Brussels with some people that do "work" tightly related/linked to EU stuff. This is EXACTLY what it feels like; and in most cases it was pretty clear to me that those people cost more money to society than any kind of "value" they were bringing. But the whole thing is politics anyway, so outcomes are kinda irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. To me it looks like a prototype of some sort of new communist system, where the "leaders" choices are completely disconnected from the rest of the population...