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In the past we could stay online for long hours doing some few activities (chatting, playing games, browsing few sites). These days we can barely survive witho

In the past we could stay online for long hours doing some few activities (chatting, playing games, browsing few sites). These days we can barely survive without a mobile phone always on, permeating every little interaction we have with the world. It’s quite a difference.

kredd 3y ago
15 years ago, we would somewhat choose whom to be “always online with”. It was more of a selected in-group of people, having similar interests and ideas. Right now, it just feels like “everyone screaming into the void” as “every app is for everyone”. It feels much different for some reason. Or maybe I’m just getting older and not a teen anymore.
- KittenInABox 3y ago
  I agree this might be the distinction. Communities are too permeable. The constant conflict we're seeing now reminds me a lot of e.g. harry potter fandom ship raids, except at a broad scale and for everything. We're not hissing about how people who want Harry and Hermione to fuck are dirty traitors to Ron and Hermione, we're trying to get someone's source of healthcare (employment) to kick them off for whatever they said about Ukraine/Russia.
serf 3y ago
>These days we can barely survive without a mobile phone always on, permeating every little interaction we have with the world. It’s quite a difference. reading all of these 'royal we' anecdotes makes me feel grateful that I can survive without a mobile quite fine. HN is as close to social media as I get -- so I guess i'm stuck wondering : are all these 'conditions' of the modern world inexorably linked and self-perpetuating? Like, if I wanted to develop a mobile-phone habit would it be best for me to get interested in social media, and vice versa? Maybe my ducking of these trends just stems from my aversion to social media all together, and that saved me from mobile-phone overuse? I don't know. But it is interesting, and wildly segmenting, that everyone around me refers to these problems that 'we' have -- but I don't. I can't be alone in this feeling. p.s. to be clear, i'm not gloating -- if anything it's kind of loneliness inducing that I can't relate to the struggle.. but it's kind of a bittersweet feeling like being one of the few who doesn't catch a plague and has to watch others suffer.
- DiscourseFan 3y ago
  I don't use social media, but I have Whatsapp groups for organizing, and its useful if I want to read something I don't have immediately on hand on the go, or if I want to take a picture, or take a call, or check the map if I want to go somewhere or if I get lost. I can look up recipes or set timers while cooking, use it as an alarm clock, stopwatch. Plus the one, billion, quadrillion apps; though, they were a lot cooler back when smartphones first came out, and, as I said, I usually don't use any apps besides email and the browser and maybe also a music streaming app. I think those are the main things I use my phone for, and getting rid of it would be very inconvenient at this point, especially since I have an iPhone anyway so I can shut off all push notifications and all tracking software and what have you. It's not 100% secure, but what can you do. Though, to be honest, I think this will be my last smartphone, I won't get another one after it breaks. I was in my local library the other day, just checking it out, and there happened to be a travel guide for a city I'm visiting soon. My god, that thing was way better than any info I've found online, and it was quite pleasant to sit down and read a book for a few hours, instead of frantically browsing through one million websites to find out what was cool, interesting, and legit, and what was a tourist trap. Its a shithole, the internet, its just a means for large-scale fraud, theft, and surveillance. But there are still a few good things left, and that redeems it somewhat.
- dgfitz 3y ago
  > I don't know. But it is interesting, and wildly segmenting, that everyone around me refers to these problems that 'we' have -- but I don't. I can't be alone in this feeling. I feel the same way. HN is as close as I get to social media, I don't even look at reddit. I think it is a "good thing" people use your "royal we" term in that at least people see phone addiction as a problem. It is usually always couched in the tone of "the problem is too far gone" which isn't a good thing. I wonder what it would be like if an entire country picked one hour during one day, and everyone just somehow disabled data on their phones, calls only, with the idea being that you only make calls that are required, not to stymie boredom.
- mindslight 3y ago
  I don't think it's a plague, but more like a bunch of attractors now that ~everyone has expectation that everyone else is "always online". I'd say I'm in a similar position as you with regards to not opting into most of it, yet I still feel the social pressure of being drawn into crap like group texts. People, who a decade or two ago wouldn't call you back for days, now pile on within the hour with walls of emote-laden content-free well-wishes. If I were 10 years younger I'd probably have declared bankruptcy already and written an LLM autoresponse bot. The other half of the mobile 1-2 punch is that the UX is terrible, due to both the limited form factor and the hostile software. People are social animals so most just suffer through it for the connection, and not knowing that the experience can be so much better on a real computer. Using software that functions across devices, I do feel the same attractors on a fully fledged desktop. But it's much less concentrated as I can read the entire context without scrolling, type out a response at a comfortable speed, and then switch away from that window until I poll it again. Whereas even with a phone running mostly libre software it feels like being sucked into a tap-tap-tap morass that I'm only using because I have to.
tmp_eSGPhx 3y ago
[dead]
JohnMakin 3y ago
Before cell phones there were beepers. and people could always reach you on a landline. or leave a message on the machine. payphones. people weren’t really that much farther than they are now, it just required a little more coordination. and cell phones have been around a lot longer than 10 years when this really picked up steam. even if you filter this statement to exclude everything but smart phones - smart, internet connected phones were around well before ~2012 when we saw a sharp spike begin in this trend, and that’s really the dawn of dominance of the YT/FB/IG/etc era.
- Klonoar 3y ago
  I would be surprised if the parent you’re responding to is even remotely discussing phone calls or answering machine messages, but rather the depth of what smartphones enable distraction-wise nowadays. Cell phones existed before but you weren’t browsing the entire web on them. ;P A beeper isn’t even in the same league and it’s really not a point here.
  - JohnMakin 3y ago
    You were definitely browsing the entire web well before 2012 on smart phones. And even before then there were internet enabled phones.
    - itishappy 3y ago
      What percentage of the population do you think had them? What percentage of school children? Nerds doing nerd stuff aren't going to affect the zeitgeist much, it's the network effect of having essentially 100% of your peers spending much of their time on social media.
    - Klonoar 3y ago
      Not everyone was there by 2012, and yes, there were internet-enabled phones but the experience was substantially worse. You are attempting to put a square into a circle here.

kredd 3y ago

15 years ago, we would somewhat choose whom to be “always online with”. It was more of a selected in-group of people, having similar interests and ideas. Right now, it just feels like “everyone screaming into the void” as “every app is for everyone”. It feels much different for some reason. Or maybe I’m just getting older and not a teen anymore.

KittenInABox 3y ago
I agree this might be the distinction. Communities are too permeable. The constant conflict we're seeing now reminds me a lot of e.g. harry potter fandom ship raids, except at a broad scale and for everything. We're not hissing about how people who want Harry and Hermione to fuck are dirty traitors to Ron and Hermione, we're trying to get someone's source of healthcare (employment) to kick them off for whatever they said about Ukraine/Russia.

serf 3y ago

>These days we can barely survive without a mobile phone always on, permeating every little interaction we have with the world. It’s quite a difference. reading all of these 'royal we' anecdotes makes me feel grateful that I can survive without a mobile quite fine. HN is as close to social media as I get -- so I guess i'm stuck wondering : are all these 'conditions' of the modern world inexorably linked and self-perpetuating? Like, if I wanted to develop a mobile-phone habit would it be best for me to get interested in social media, and vice versa? Maybe my ducking of these trends just stems from my aversion to social media all together, and that saved me from mobile-phone overuse? I don't know. But it is interesting, and wildly segmenting, that everyone around me refers to these problems that 'we' have -- but I don't. I can't be alone in this feeling. p.s. to be clear, i'm not gloating -- if anything it's kind of loneliness inducing that I can't relate to the struggle.. but it's kind of a bittersweet feeling like being one of the few who doesn't catch a plague and has to watch others suffer.

DiscourseFan 3y ago
I don't use social media, but I have Whatsapp groups for organizing, and its useful if I want to read something I don't have immediately on hand on the go, or if I want to take a picture, or take a call, or check the map if I want to go somewhere or if I get lost. I can look up recipes or set timers while cooking, use it as an alarm clock, stopwatch. Plus the one, billion, quadrillion apps; though, they were a lot cooler back when smartphones first came out, and, as I said, I usually don't use any apps besides email and the browser and maybe also a music streaming app. I think those are the main things I use my phone for, and getting rid of it would be very inconvenient at this point, especially since I have an iPhone anyway so I can shut off all push notifications and all tracking software and what have you. It's not 100% secure, but what can you do. Though, to be honest, I think this will be my last smartphone, I won't get another one after it breaks. I was in my local library the other day, just checking it out, and there happened to be a travel guide for a city I'm visiting soon. My god, that thing was way better than any info I've found online, and it was quite pleasant to sit down and read a book for a few hours, instead of frantically browsing through one million websites to find out what was cool, interesting, and legit, and what was a tourist trap. Its a shithole, the internet, its just a means for large-scale fraud, theft, and surveillance. But there are still a few good things left, and that redeems it somewhat.
dgfitz 3y ago
> I don't know. But it is interesting, and wildly segmenting, that everyone around me refers to these problems that 'we' have -- but I don't. I can't be alone in this feeling. I feel the same way. HN is as close as I get to social media, I don't even look at reddit. I think it is a "good thing" people use your "royal we" term in that at least people see phone addiction as a problem. It is usually always couched in the tone of "the problem is too far gone" which isn't a good thing. I wonder what it would be like if an entire country picked one hour during one day, and everyone just somehow disabled data on their phones, calls only, with the idea being that you only make calls that are required, not to stymie boredom.
mindslight 3y ago
I don't think it's a plague, but more like a bunch of attractors now that ~everyone has expectation that everyone else is "always online". I'd say I'm in a similar position as you with regards to not opting into most of it, yet I still feel the social pressure of being drawn into crap like group texts. People, who a decade or two ago wouldn't call you back for days, now pile on within the hour with walls of emote-laden content-free well-wishes. If I were 10 years younger I'd probably have declared bankruptcy already and written an LLM autoresponse bot. The other half of the mobile 1-2 punch is that the UX is terrible, due to both the limited form factor and the hostile software. People are social animals so most just suffer through it for the connection, and not knowing that the experience can be so much better on a real computer. Using software that functions across devices, I do feel the same attractors on a fully fledged desktop. But it's much less concentrated as I can read the entire context without scrolling, type out a response at a comfortable speed, and then switch away from that window until I poll it again. Whereas even with a phone running mostly libre software it feels like being sucked into a tap-tap-tap morass that I'm only using because I have to.

tmp_eSGPhx 3y ago

[dead]

JohnMakin 3y ago

Before cell phones there were beepers. and people could always reach you on a landline. or leave a message on the machine. payphones. people weren’t really that much farther than they are now, it just required a little more coordination. and cell phones have been around a lot longer than 10 years when this really picked up steam. even if you filter this statement to exclude everything but smart phones - smart, internet connected phones were around well before ~2012 when we saw a sharp spike begin in this trend, and that’s really the dawn of dominance of the YT/FB/IG/etc era.

Klonoar 3y ago
I would be surprised if the parent you’re responding to is even remotely discussing phone calls or answering machine messages, but rather the depth of what smartphones enable distraction-wise nowadays. Cell phones existed before but you weren’t browsing the entire web on them. ;P A beeper isn’t even in the same league and it’s really not a point here.
- JohnMakin 3y ago
  You were definitely browsing the entire web well before 2012 on smart phones. And even before then there were internet enabled phones.
  - itishappy 3y ago
    What percentage of the population do you think had them? What percentage of school children? Nerds doing nerd stuff aren't going to affect the zeitgeist much, it's the network effect of having essentially 100% of your peers spending much of their time on social media.
  - Klonoar 3y ago
    Not everyone was there by 2012, and yes, there were internet-enabled phones but the experience was substantially worse. You are attempting to put a square into a circle here.