5 ms·

Crypto shills be shilling hard on HN.

toss1 3y ago
Yup, there's no question that one can find innovative edge-cases such as this. But they are just that, edge cases. And they will stay that way. If a case like this were to become the main use of cryptocurrency, it would be a travesty, as it would be better to not burn the excess energy for hash-searching but to innovate better distributed storage-retrieval at that scale.
- kevinak 3y ago
  Why would it be a travesty to bring electricity to those that do not have it?
  - toss1 3y ago
    If that's what you got out of that post, I must have been unclear Of course it's good to bring electricity to those who lack it and want it. But if that program ever gets so big that using any excess to mine crypto is a major use-case for crypto, then such programs have achieved a scale that rather than mining crypto with the excess everyone would be much better off, and sufficient scale would have been achieved that it would be more feasible & beneficial to develop better methods of excess-energy-storage I.e., better at scale to [increase total energy availability] than to [mine crypto].
    - npoc 3y ago
      Where's the need to store the energy if mining bitcoin is at least as cost effective? It's almost as if you see bitcoin mining as a waste of energy
      - smoldesu 3y ago
        > It's almost as if you see bitcoin mining as a waste of energy Bitcoin mining is a waste of energy, by design. It is proof-of-work; it is built from the ground up to repeatedly spend electricity on redundant calculations.
        npoc 3y ago
        Proof of work - yes - this is fundamental to any fair money, including gold, Rai stones, even beads and shells etc. Would you consider gold mining a waste of energy? If you don't need to perform work of equivalent value to the money you are creating, what do you think will happen? (here's a clue: https://ibb.co/pWZfMQc https://ibb.co/pWZfMQc)
        smoldesu 3y ago
        > Would you consider gold mining a waste of energy? If the amount of work put into getting it is not reciprocal to the value of the outcome, then yes I would consider it a waste. So would most commercial gold miners, I reckon. > If you don't need to perform work of equivalent value to the money you are creating, what do you think will happen? The work miners do doesn't give Bitcoin it's value, the supply and demand economy does. Miners are supposed to validate blocks and push the ledger forward, without an active trading economy their work is inherently wasted. That's like... Bitcoin 101 right there. God help you if you own any.
        deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
        npoc 3y ago
        That's not bitcoin 101. That's nonsense. Have a good day.
npoc 3y ago
The article is about bitcoin, not cRyPTo
- smoldesu 3y ago
  Bitcoin is absolutely cryptocurrency and deserves zero exemption from the category.
  - npoc 3y ago
    It's completely different to cRypTo though. Crypto is essentially 10,000 scams (or naive projects at best) while bitcoin is one of the most important inventions in the history of mankind. That deserves some distinction.
    - smoldesu 3y ago
      > It's completely different to cRypTo though. Really? Explain how. And please, use the actual definition of cryptocurrency instead of your subjective shill one. > That deserves some distinction. It wouldn't deserve to be un-classified as a cryptocurrency if it was the E-gold whitepaper republished by Hal Finney himself. Bitcoin is a cryptocurrency, besides being popular there is almost nothing unique about the blockchain itself.
      - npoc 3y ago
        If you believe I'm shilling rather than helping you, then I'll stop right here. Have a good day.
    - rsynnott 3y ago
      This feels a bit like those KJV Christians; only one highly-specific variant of the thing is the One True Thing, while all of the nearly identical things are HERESY. Bitcoin's essentially a self-organising scam, just like the rest of them.
      - npoc 3y ago

Yup, there's no question that one can find innovative edge-cases such as this. But they are just that, edge cases. And they will stay that way. If a case like this were to become the main use of cryptocurrency, it would be a travesty, as it would be better to not burn the excess energy for hash-searching but to innovate better distributed storage-retrieval at that scale.

kevinak 3y ago
Why would it be a travesty to bring electricity to those that do not have it?
- toss1 3y ago
  If that's what you got out of that post, I must have been unclear Of course it's good to bring electricity to those who lack it and want it. But if that program ever gets so big that using any excess to mine crypto is a major use-case for crypto, then such programs have achieved a scale that rather than mining crypto with the excess everyone would be much better off, and sufficient scale would have been achieved that it would be more feasible & beneficial to develop better methods of excess-energy-storage I.e., better at scale to [increase total energy availability] than to [mine crypto].
  - npoc 3y ago
    Where's the need to store the energy if mining bitcoin is at least as cost effective? It's almost as if you see bitcoin mining as a waste of energy
    - smoldesu 3y ago
      > It's almost as if you see bitcoin mining as a waste of energy Bitcoin mining is a waste of energy, by design. It is proof-of-work; it is built from the ground up to repeatedly spend electricity on redundant calculations.
      - npoc 3y ago
        Proof of work - yes - this is fundamental to any fair money, including gold, Rai stones, even beads and shells etc. Would you consider gold mining a waste of energy? If you don't need to perform work of equivalent value to the money you are creating, what do you think will happen? (here's a clue: https://ibb.co/pWZfMQc https://ibb.co/pWZfMQc)
        smoldesu 3y ago
        > Would you consider gold mining a waste of energy? If the amount of work put into getting it is not reciprocal to the value of the outcome, then yes I would consider it a waste. So would most commercial gold miners, I reckon. > If you don't need to perform work of equivalent value to the money you are creating, what do you think will happen? The work miners do doesn't give Bitcoin it's value, the supply and demand economy does. Miners are supposed to validate blocks and push the ledger forward, without an active trading economy their work is inherently wasted. That's like... Bitcoin 101 right there. God help you if you own any.
        deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
        npoc 3y ago
        That's not bitcoin 101. That's nonsense. Have a good day.

npoc 3y ago

The article is about bitcoin, not cRyPTo

smoldesu 3y ago
Bitcoin is absolutely cryptocurrency and deserves zero exemption from the category.
- npoc 3y ago
  It's completely different to cRypTo though. Crypto is essentially 10,000 scams (or naive projects at best) while bitcoin is one of the most important inventions in the history of mankind. That deserves some distinction.
  - smoldesu 3y ago
    > It's completely different to cRypTo though. Really? Explain how. And please, use the actual definition of cryptocurrency instead of your subjective shill one. > That deserves some distinction. It wouldn't deserve to be un-classified as a cryptocurrency if it was the E-gold whitepaper republished by Hal Finney himself. Bitcoin is a cryptocurrency, besides being popular there is almost nothing unique about the blockchain itself.
    - npoc 3y ago
      If you believe I'm shilling rather than helping you, then I'll stop right here. Have a good day.
  - rsynnott 3y ago
    This feels a bit like those KJV Christians; only one highly-specific variant of the thing is the One True Thing, while all of the nearly identical things are HERESY. Bitcoin's essentially a self-organising scam, just like the rest of them.
    - npoc 3y ago