5 ms·

Our bad reputation is not entirely undeserved, some of us are not as well behaved as others.

by tmtvl 3y ago

Uptrenda 3y ago
[flagged]
- augustohp 3y ago
  Although I agree his words could've been chosen more carefully, they come from someone used to work with computers. Not his forte.
- jraph 3y ago
  OTOH do they need more input from external contributors? They have everything they need. google.com serves '<!DOCTYPE html>' to Firefox and that's the end of the webcompat story. Google needs to fix this. Full stop. Given this, I can see how this thing can attract low quality comments and have a very low chance of receiving interesting insight. Now, since we are on HN I'll provide my one low quality comment on this: I guess it's a silly mistake that's not intended, but still feels like another whoops [1]. Also: come on Google, seriously? Don't you have QA for such things? [1] https://www.zdnet.com/article/former-mozilla-exec-google-has-sabotaged-firefox-for-years/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/former-mozilla-exec-google-has...
- jgraham 3y ago
  (I work on WebCompat at Mozilla) There are various people whose job involves triaging issues filed on that repo, and communicating with the issue authors where necessary e.g. to figure out additional steps required to reproduce the reported problem. The point of that effort is exactly because we value reports of site breakage so highly, and want to ensure that people reporting them have a good experience. Unfortunately when a bug report (not just this in this repo, but almost anywhere) hits (almost any) social media there's a high chance of the suddenly large audience making comments that aren't at all actionable in fixing the issue. In this case it seems highly unlikely that anyone can add additional information that will allow a faster resolution, whereas there was already one off-topic/unactionable comment at the time the issue was locked. So if we leave the issue open, it has the downside of disrupting our normal workflows, and taking attention away from fixing either the problem at hand, or any other issues that currently require our attention. To me that significantly outweighs the potential upside of leaving it open to "make people feel welcome". Of course, like many things in life, it's not a mathematical problem where you can derive a correct answer, but a set of tradeoffs based on experience, and therefore reasonable people may come to different conclusions.
  - lightedman 3y ago
    "There are various people whose job involves triaging issues filed on that repo, and communicating with the issue authors where necessary e.g. to figure out additional steps required to reproduce the reported problem." And exactly where are the various QUALITY CONTROL testers that should've caught such a dead-simple problem like "This won't work with Google Search" before it ever happened in the first place?
    - denschub 3y ago
      This issue was caused by Google on their server-side, without any relation to a change in Firefox, so I'm not sure why you feel the need to yell at my Mozilla-colleague.
      - lightedman 3y ago
        As a quality control technician, I have several tests, including checking against third party resources for compatibility. If I were a web browser coder, making sure my software worked with the major websites of the internet would be the FIRST thing to test. I don't release until I know it works. This exact same mindset is why I make the expensive stuff where I work, and nobody else. I'm also not yelling. That you think text is yelling is quite something I'll never understand from anyone. Two capitalized words isn't yelling.
  - Uptrenda 3y ago
    Nah, that's bullshit. If someone interacts with your team on whatever medium you go out of your way to be respectful and shouldn't act like stuck up, condescending neckbeards, whose presence is a gift to humanity. I run many open source repos myself and you can bet that when people take the trouble to interact with me I make it my mission to listen to what they say and treat them with respect. I don't expect them to act like robots and neither should you. The way you've all answered here makes me think that you're a bunch of code monkeys incapable of understanding that software is created for human beings and not machines. >In this case it seems highly unlikely that anyone can add additional information that will allow a faster resolution Heaven forbid. Sounds like Mozilla is a wonderful and fun place to work. Lmao. >of disrupting our normal workflows, and taking attention away from fixing either the problem at hand People aren't going to die if a few off-topic comments are posted. Holy fuck, what is wrong with you. >To me that significantly outweighs the potential upside of leaving it open to "make people feel welcome". That's exactly the problem. Acting like regular users have no worthwhile input is unbelievably out of touch and just plain insufferable. Maybe if you listened more to the user you could build a browser that wasn't such a piece of shit. Lmao.
- doix 3y ago
  Oh come on. As soon as any issue hits any "social media" site, the comments turn to shit with people inserting their own clever meme or whatever. The bug is well understood, there's nothing to gain from keeping the issue open and a lot to lose. Getting notifications for "shit posts" is pretty annoying. _Maybe_ they could have avoided explicitly calling out HN and just said "social media" or whatever. But you're really pulling at straws to get offended here. I don't think their an asshole, I think they're pragmatic.
- bigbillheck 3y ago
  A bit of searching suggests that this individual is the same 'robertsdotpm' who posted that "b-bazinga" comment, or at least is closely associated with them.
  - striking 3y ago
    Good catch. No wonder their comment sounded so defensive, they're the bad guy!
  - temp0826 3y ago
    Not sure why you're getting downvoted. Googlers? Obviously scummy behavior should be highlighted.
    - bigbillheck 3y ago
      > Not sure why you're getting downvoted People will upvote and downvote on this site as they please, and caring about it is a recipe for a bad time.
politelemon 3y ago
It's one of those occasional intersections where we are reminded that our reputation within HN comments does not reflect the outside world.
pwdisswordfishc 3y ago
[flagged]

Our bad reputation is not entirely undeserved, some of us are not as well behaved as others.

by tmtvl 3y ago

Our bad reputation is not entirely undeserved, some of us are not as well behaved as others.

Uptrenda 3y ago

[flagged]

augustohp 3y ago
Although I agree his words could've been chosen more carefully, they come from someone used to work with computers. Not his forte.
jraph 3y ago
OTOH do they need more input from external contributors? They have everything they need. google.com serves '<!DOCTYPE html>' to Firefox and that's the end of the webcompat story. Google needs to fix this. Full stop. Given this, I can see how this thing can attract low quality comments and have a very low chance of receiving interesting insight. Now, since we are on HN I'll provide my one low quality comment on this: I guess it's a silly mistake that's not intended, but still feels like another whoops [1]. Also: come on Google, seriously? Don't you have QA for such things? [1] https://www.zdnet.com/article/former-mozilla-exec-google-has-sabotaged-firefox-for-years/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/former-mozilla-exec-google-has...
jgraham 3y ago
(I work on WebCompat at Mozilla) There are various people whose job involves triaging issues filed on that repo, and communicating with the issue authors where necessary e.g. to figure out additional steps required to reproduce the reported problem. The point of that effort is exactly because we value reports of site breakage so highly, and want to ensure that people reporting them have a good experience. Unfortunately when a bug report (not just this in this repo, but almost anywhere) hits (almost any) social media there's a high chance of the suddenly large audience making comments that aren't at all actionable in fixing the issue. In this case it seems highly unlikely that anyone can add additional information that will allow a faster resolution, whereas there was already one off-topic/unactionable comment at the time the issue was locked. So if we leave the issue open, it has the downside of disrupting our normal workflows, and taking attention away from fixing either the problem at hand, or any other issues that currently require our attention. To me that significantly outweighs the potential upside of leaving it open to "make people feel welcome". Of course, like many things in life, it's not a mathematical problem where you can derive a correct answer, but a set of tradeoffs based on experience, and therefore reasonable people may come to different conclusions.
- lightedman 3y ago
  "There are various people whose job involves triaging issues filed on that repo, and communicating with the issue authors where necessary e.g. to figure out additional steps required to reproduce the reported problem." And exactly where are the various QUALITY CONTROL testers that should've caught such a dead-simple problem like "This won't work with Google Search" before it ever happened in the first place?
  - denschub 3y ago
    This issue was caused by Google on their server-side, without any relation to a change in Firefox, so I'm not sure why you feel the need to yell at my Mozilla-colleague.
    - lightedman 3y ago
      As a quality control technician, I have several tests, including checking against third party resources for compatibility. If I were a web browser coder, making sure my software worked with the major websites of the internet would be the FIRST thing to test. I don't release until I know it works. This exact same mindset is why I make the expensive stuff where I work, and nobody else. I'm also not yelling. That you think text is yelling is quite something I'll never understand from anyone. Two capitalized words isn't yelling.
- Uptrenda 3y ago
  Nah, that's bullshit. If someone interacts with your team on whatever medium you go out of your way to be respectful and shouldn't act like stuck up, condescending neckbeards, whose presence is a gift to humanity. I run many open source repos myself and you can bet that when people take the trouble to interact with me I make it my mission to listen to what they say and treat them with respect. I don't expect them to act like robots and neither should you. The way you've all answered here makes me think that you're a bunch of code monkeys incapable of understanding that software is created for human beings and not machines. >In this case it seems highly unlikely that anyone can add additional information that will allow a faster resolution Heaven forbid. Sounds like Mozilla is a wonderful and fun place to work. Lmao. >of disrupting our normal workflows, and taking attention away from fixing either the problem at hand People aren't going to die if a few off-topic comments are posted. Holy fuck, what is wrong with you. >To me that significantly outweighs the potential upside of leaving it open to "make people feel welcome". That's exactly the problem. Acting like regular users have no worthwhile input is unbelievably out of touch and just plain insufferable. Maybe if you listened more to the user you could build a browser that wasn't such a piece of shit. Lmao.
doix 3y ago
Oh come on. As soon as any issue hits any "social media" site, the comments turn to shit with people inserting their own clever meme or whatever. The bug is well understood, there's nothing to gain from keeping the issue open and a lot to lose. Getting notifications for "shit posts" is pretty annoying. _Maybe_ they could have avoided explicitly calling out HN and just said "social media" or whatever. But you're really pulling at straws to get offended here. I don't think their an asshole, I think they're pragmatic.
bigbillheck 3y ago
A bit of searching suggests that this individual is the same 'robertsdotpm' who posted that "b-bazinga" comment, or at least is closely associated with them.
- striking 3y ago
  Good catch. No wonder their comment sounded so defensive, they're the bad guy!
- temp0826 3y ago
  Not sure why you're getting downvoted. Googlers? Obviously scummy behavior should be highlighted.
  - bigbillheck 3y ago
    > Not sure why you're getting downvoted People will upvote and downvote on this site as they please, and caring about it is a recipe for a bad time.

politelemon 3y ago

It's one of those occasional intersections where we are reminded that our reputation within HN comments does not reflect the outside world.

pwdisswordfishc 3y ago

[flagged]