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> I think the common notion is that the survival of the individual is exactly what natural selection is selecting for. when we reproduce, do we make copies of

> I think the common notion is that the survival of the individual is exactly what natural selection is selecting for. when we reproduce, do we make copies of ourselves? no we don't. It's not survival of individuals. Read the Selfish Gene and it will change your thinking. You as an individual are a piece of clothing for your genes. Your genes reproduce, you don't.

AnthonyMouse 3y ago
> Your genes reproduce, you don't. It's more complicated than that. Your genes reproduce, but then that child is in your care, and you teach them your values. Then your values reproduce. And then you're into nature vs. nurture. Your values can't reproduce if you have stupid genes that cause your offspring to die of cystic fibrosis, but your genes can't reproduce if you have stupid values that cause your offspring to be self-destructive and sterile. "You" are the combination of your genes and your values, and whether there gets to be any more of that depends on whether you, as a whole, are any good at it.
- startupsfail 3y ago
  Yep. The immune system is watching for that and killing you off, if you’re being a social reject. That works for any social animal. Plus for humans there’s also a suicide trick.
  - d1sxeyes 3y ago
    Not sure if you're being facetious or not, but it's not the immune system killing you off. That said, you are less likely to reproduce successfully if you are 'a social reject'. You will meet fewer potential mates, fewer of those will be willing to reproduce with you, etc. Whatever it was that made you a social reject, if it's something you can pass on either through nature or nuture, is less likely to be passed on.
    - wegfawefgawefg 3y ago
      I believe he is refering to the relationship between stress and autoimmune disease, which is responsible for a large majority of the heart disease, cancer, and other deaths. source: Robert Sapolsky, Zebras Dont Get Ulcers
yterdy 3y ago
>when we reproduce, do we make copies of ourselves? You have been blessed not to grow up with a narcissist or vicarious striver as a parent. Technically, cars are a means of transportation for people. However, an honest assessment of the American transit system might lead one to believe that the safety and comfort of cars (or the automotive industry and ecosystem) are more important than the people they're supposed to ferry. In reality, the system is complex, incentives and drives are many; a holistic view is more useful than forcing a tortured atomic hierarchy onto that system.
- bryanrasmussen 3y ago
  Vicarious striver sounds like you have a psychological diagnosis in mind, but I can't find anything on it?
  - yterdy 3y ago
    A parent who pushes their child to carry out their own unfulfilled ambitions. The archetypical college athlete who "coulda gone pro" dumping tons of time, energy, and money into their kid's travel team, or the tiger parent for whom anything less than an A is the end of the world because how else are you going to become a doctor?
wegfawefgawefg 3y ago
In the future, you should read full comments before you respond. I explicitly stated what i thought as contrary to the "survival of individuals". Not only have I read the selfish gene, but I included 3 facts from the book in my comment...

AnthonyMouse 3y ago

> Your genes reproduce, you don't. It's more complicated than that. Your genes reproduce, but then that child is in your care, and you teach them your values. Then your values reproduce. And then you're into nature vs. nurture. Your values can't reproduce if you have stupid genes that cause your offspring to die of cystic fibrosis, but your genes can't reproduce if you have stupid values that cause your offspring to be self-destructive and sterile. "You" are the combination of your genes and your values, and whether there gets to be any more of that depends on whether you, as a whole, are any good at it.

startupsfail 3y ago
Yep. The immune system is watching for that and killing you off, if you’re being a social reject. That works for any social animal. Plus for humans there’s also a suicide trick.
- d1sxeyes 3y ago
  Not sure if you're being facetious or not, but it's not the immune system killing you off. That said, you are less likely to reproduce successfully if you are 'a social reject'. You will meet fewer potential mates, fewer of those will be willing to reproduce with you, etc. Whatever it was that made you a social reject, if it's something you can pass on either through nature or nuture, is less likely to be passed on.
  - wegfawefgawefg 3y ago
    I believe he is refering to the relationship between stress and autoimmune disease, which is responsible for a large majority of the heart disease, cancer, and other deaths. source: Robert Sapolsky, Zebras Dont Get Ulcers

yterdy 3y ago

>when we reproduce, do we make copies of ourselves? You have been blessed not to grow up with a narcissist or vicarious striver as a parent. Technically, cars are a means of transportation for people. However, an honest assessment of the American transit system might lead one to believe that the safety and comfort of cars (or the automotive industry and ecosystem) are more important than the people they're supposed to ferry. In reality, the system is complex, incentives and drives are many; a holistic view is more useful than forcing a tortured atomic hierarchy onto that system.

bryanrasmussen 3y ago
Vicarious striver sounds like you have a psychological diagnosis in mind, but I can't find anything on it?
- yterdy 3y ago
  A parent who pushes their child to carry out their own unfulfilled ambitions. The archetypical college athlete who "coulda gone pro" dumping tons of time, energy, and money into their kid's travel team, or the tiger parent for whom anything less than an A is the end of the world because how else are you going to become a doctor?

wegfawefgawefg 3y ago

In the future, you should read full comments before you respond. I explicitly stated what i thought as contrary to the "survival of individuals". Not only have I read the selfish gene, but I included 3 facts from the book in my comment...