3 ms·

Hope they learn from PHP. Their gradual typing is very pragmatic.

by ilrwbwrkhv 3y ago

zilti 3y ago
[flagged]
- baranul 3y ago
  [dead]
- hu3 3y ago
  I find this this kind of prejudice towards technologies rather reductionist and limiting, to say the least. During interviews I conduct, broad generalizations towards any technology, be it Visual Basic or Rust, for example, are noted as red flags. My rationale is that engineers should be able to understand that tooling is a matter of context + tradeoffs. There are lessons to be learned in almost any technology. Even more so in battle-tested technologies. And PHP is still a very popular tool that has come a long way over almost three decades since its creation (mid 1994). Things that come to mind that are worth looking for inspiration in PHP: - package management (composer is great) - gradual typing (9 years of use-cases to learn from) - framework popularity (what makes Laravel so popular?) - staying power (why is it still so popular after 3 decades?) - governance and community development model (continuous improvements since inception and relatively little drama) - backwards compatibility (major changes of internals with very little compatibility breaks. PHP's engine had major core changes while still maintaining friendly levels of backwards compatibility. And JIT is on the way.) https://www.php.net/manual/en/history.php.php https://www.php.net/manual/en/history.php.php
- DarkNova6 3y ago
  PHP is indeed a good showcase how much improvement can be done, even if the foundation is flawed. In fact, limiting the scope to "how to introduce typing", PHP has done almost everything right. It even rejects nulls by default and I would have wished Python had been just as rigorous in this regard.
- dang 3y ago
  Could you please stop posting unsubstantive comments and flamebait? You've unfortunately been doing it repeatedly. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for. If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful. (Other examples: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38918417 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38918417 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38917440 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38917440 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38917178 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38917178 )
sodapopcan 3y ago
Elixir, and Erlang before it, has always essentially had gradual typing through pattern matching and non-overloaded operators, they just get caught at runtime. This is bringing those checks to compile time.
phplovesong 3y ago
PHP's "typesystem" is anything but good.

Hope they learn from PHP. Their gradual typing is very pragmatic.

zilti 3y ago

[flagged]

baranul 3y ago
[dead]
hu3 3y ago
I find this this kind of prejudice towards technologies rather reductionist and limiting, to say the least. During interviews I conduct, broad generalizations towards any technology, be it Visual Basic or Rust, for example, are noted as red flags. My rationale is that engineers should be able to understand that tooling is a matter of context + tradeoffs. There are lessons to be learned in almost any technology. Even more so in battle-tested technologies. And PHP is still a very popular tool that has come a long way over almost three decades since its creation (mid 1994). Things that come to mind that are worth looking for inspiration in PHP: - package management (composer is great) - gradual typing (9 years of use-cases to learn from) - framework popularity (what makes Laravel so popular?) - staying power (why is it still so popular after 3 decades?) - governance and community development model (continuous improvements since inception and relatively little drama) - backwards compatibility (major changes of internals with very little compatibility breaks. PHP's engine had major core changes while still maintaining friendly levels of backwards compatibility. And JIT is on the way.) https://www.php.net/manual/en/history.php.php https://www.php.net/manual/en/history.php.php
DarkNova6 3y ago
PHP is indeed a good showcase how much improvement can be done, even if the foundation is flawed. In fact, limiting the scope to "how to introduce typing", PHP has done almost everything right. It even rejects nulls by default and I would have wished Python had been just as rigorous in this regard.
dang 3y ago
Could you please stop posting unsubstantive comments and flamebait? You've unfortunately been doing it repeatedly. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for. If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful. (Other examples: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38918417 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38918417 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38917440 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38917440 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38917178 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38917178 )

sodapopcan 3y ago

Elixir, and Erlang before it, has always essentially had gradual typing through pattern matching and non-overloaded operators, they just get caught at runtime. This is bringing those checks to compile time.

phplovesong 3y ago

PHP's "typesystem" is anything but good.