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This x1000. My sense is that because of the historical development of how we talked about AI in constant comparison to human intelligence, along with sci-fi dre

This x1000. My sense is that because of the historical development of how we talked about AI in constant comparison to human intelligence, along with sci-fi dreams, there's been a long-standing implicit value assumption that we necessarily want robots that emulate humans, but I'm highly skeptical this is actually desirable. It's quite plausible that robots that are just robots and don't waste effort on human emulation are actually far more beneficial societally speaking.

steveBK123 3y ago
I would think of robots as tools. And in that sense, over time humans tools have gotten more advanced and specialized. Think about the various power tools & garden/yard tools a median DIY homeowner accumulates today vs 50 years ago. So to me, robots make more sense in purpose driven forms than in some humanoid replica attempt. The humanoid walking form factor is far harder to accomplish, and in many senses possibly less useful.
- leksak 3y ago
  I think what a lot of people want, again influenced by sci-fi, is a general-purpose robot that can do everything a human can do and preferably other things beyond that. One form factor that can do everything we do is obviously the way we humans look hence the inclination to design robots that look like us as well. I could have multiple robots, one for vacuuming, one for doing the dishes, one for gardening, cleaning, renovating, etc. But, if I had one to do all of it any of the purpose-driven forms is likely to fail while the humanoid one _could_ succeed.
  - steveBK123 3y ago
    Humanoid robots strike me as a FSD/AGI level of overshoot. Sure a humanoid robot that actually worked would be able to accomplish everything a human could physically because of the way interior spaces are designed. But focussing on that deliverable may miss a lot of available use case solutions. For example robotic vacuums and lawn mowers have been around, pretty cheap, and pretty good for some time. There's lots of home chores that a wheeled robovac with telescoping arms & really good vision could accomplish very well (empty/load dishwasher to/from sink/cabinets, light kitchen work, dusting, sweeping, etc). To deliver this in humanoid form you need to solve all the same vision/arm articulation problems, PLUS all the self balancing/walking/look&feel stuff of a humanoid. There's actually stuff a robot could do better than me if it had a telescoping arm instead of being humanoid look&feel focussed (dusting / reaching high places etc). To me it conflates 2 problems and overcomplicates to focus on the humanoid form factor at this stage. And look at the evolution of some tools - cars do not really look like horse drawn carriages for example. Helicopters don't look like flying cars.
    - actionfromafar 3y ago
      Agreed with caveats. A good general robot would still probably have similar mass to a human, appendages with similar reach, and so on. A horse carriage and a modern car have similar sizes, can take similar amounts of cargo and seating, and take up similar space on the road. So a good generic bot needn’t be an android, but in that ballpark.

steveBK123 3y ago

I would think of robots as tools. And in that sense, over time humans tools have gotten more advanced and specialized. Think about the various power tools & garden/yard tools a median DIY homeowner accumulates today vs 50 years ago. So to me, robots make more sense in purpose driven forms than in some humanoid replica attempt. The humanoid walking form factor is far harder to accomplish, and in many senses possibly less useful.

leksak 3y ago
I think what a lot of people want, again influenced by sci-fi, is a general-purpose robot that can do everything a human can do and preferably other things beyond that. One form factor that can do everything we do is obviously the way we humans look hence the inclination to design robots that look like us as well. I could have multiple robots, one for vacuuming, one for doing the dishes, one for gardening, cleaning, renovating, etc. But, if I had one to do all of it any of the purpose-driven forms is likely to fail while the humanoid one _could_ succeed.
- steveBK123 3y ago
  Humanoid robots strike me as a FSD/AGI level of overshoot. Sure a humanoid robot that actually worked would be able to accomplish everything a human could physically because of the way interior spaces are designed. But focussing on that deliverable may miss a lot of available use case solutions. For example robotic vacuums and lawn mowers have been around, pretty cheap, and pretty good for some time. There's lots of home chores that a wheeled robovac with telescoping arms & really good vision could accomplish very well (empty/load dishwasher to/from sink/cabinets, light kitchen work, dusting, sweeping, etc). To deliver this in humanoid form you need to solve all the same vision/arm articulation problems, PLUS all the self balancing/walking/look&feel stuff of a humanoid. There's actually stuff a robot could do better than me if it had a telescoping arm instead of being humanoid look&feel focussed (dusting / reaching high places etc). To me it conflates 2 problems and overcomplicates to focus on the humanoid form factor at this stage. And look at the evolution of some tools - cars do not really look like horse drawn carriages for example. Helicopters don't look like flying cars.
  - actionfromafar 3y ago
    Agreed with caveats. A good general robot would still probably have similar mass to a human, appendages with similar reach, and so on. A horse carriage and a modern car have similar sizes, can take similar amounts of cargo and seating, and take up similar space on the road. So a good generic bot needn’t be an android, but in that ballpark.