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"If you run to the press and trash us, it never helps." — App Store Review Guidelines, 2010 (https://www.cultofmac.com/58590/heres-the-full-text-of-apples-new-a

"If you run to the press and trash us, it never helps." — App Store Review Guidelines, 2010 (https://www.cultofmac.com/58590/heres-the-full-text-of-apples-new-app-store-guidelines/ https://www.cultofmac.com/58590/heres-the-full-text-of-apple...) (It often helps.)

cma 3y ago
That statement seems like it would legally be extortion. I guess by only saying never helps and not that it hurts, it isn't?
- meibo 3y ago
  > That statement seems like it would legally be extortion. Like their entire App Store business?
  - wutwutwat 3y ago
    While I see what you’re trying to say here, the App Store is not extortion. You don’t have to build an app for their platform. If you do, you do so knowing beforehand that the app requires approval to be listed on their App Store, and that such approval is not guaranteed or owed just because you think it is. You’re also free to distribute the app privately the way many enterprises do, and how services like TestFlight work. You can use web technologies and bypass any App Store, revenue cut, or approval process. Every step of the way no matter which way you go, you’re making an informed choice, willingly. Choosing to go down the App Store path, regardless of if side loading is available or not, is not extortion. Nobody forced you to build an app for a platform that requires approval and has a long history of denying apps. I don’t understand the attitude everyone has where they feel entitled to shit just because it’s something they want. Private company. Closed platform. Walled garden. Approval process. This isn’t a democracy and never was. Why do you think you can will something you don’t own or have any decision making powers at into something it never claimed to be and never was? Fix capitalism, or change our culture not to revolve around greed and maximizing profits, and the shit Apple does won’t happen. If there is a way to make more money, walled gardens to extract more money will always exist.
    - TheLoafOfBread 3y ago
      How do I use PWA with BLE on iOS? I can't unless I will use App Store and native application. So I have no choice but to use App Store.
      - wutwutwat 3y ago
        You have a choice, don’t make an iPhone app if you don’t want to deal with the App Store.
    - meibo 3y ago
      In my opinion, all of this falls apart once you consider that Apple has sabotaged the mobile web as an application platform basically since the inception of the iPhone. You actually just don't have a choice if you want to reach that audience, in a lot of cases. Heck, we only now just got Web Push which sort of kinda works sometimes on mobile Safari at the moment. I also disagree that every organization in a capitalist society has to be inherently evil, but that might be more of a fundamental discussion ;)
      - mediumsmart 3y ago
        Apple has sabotaged the mobile web as an application platform basically since the inception of the iPhone. There was a mobile web before the iPhone?
        kristiandupont 3y ago
        That's fair but it doesn't refute GP's point. Things have improved vastly with the introduction of web push but Apple is still dragging their feet on making it possible to create a good mobile experience with web-only apps. Now, I generally don't like conspiracy theories and I seek not to attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity (or even a lack of attention, etc.) However, in this particular case it seems very obvious to me that Apple is doing it in order to force developers to build native apps.
    - paulddraper 3y ago
ksec 3y ago
>"If you run to the press and trash us, it never helps." The context is that Steve was still involve with Apple's decision. It is similar to a lot of things at Apple. They were there for a reason but it seems a lot of the context were gone once Steve was not there.
- junofan 3y ago
  Now that’s a dude who’d been around the block a few times. It’s just not worth it to do business with people who treat you like garbage. No matter how big you are or how small they are.

cma 3y ago

That statement seems like it would legally be extortion. I guess by only saying never helps and not that it hurts, it isn't?

meibo 3y ago
> That statement seems like it would legally be extortion. Like their entire App Store business?
- wutwutwat 3y ago
  While I see what you’re trying to say here, the App Store is not extortion. You don’t have to build an app for their platform. If you do, you do so knowing beforehand that the app requires approval to be listed on their App Store, and that such approval is not guaranteed or owed just because you think it is. You’re also free to distribute the app privately the way many enterprises do, and how services like TestFlight work. You can use web technologies and bypass any App Store, revenue cut, or approval process. Every step of the way no matter which way you go, you’re making an informed choice, willingly. Choosing to go down the App Store path, regardless of if side loading is available or not, is not extortion. Nobody forced you to build an app for a platform that requires approval and has a long history of denying apps. I don’t understand the attitude everyone has where they feel entitled to shit just because it’s something they want. Private company. Closed platform. Walled garden. Approval process. This isn’t a democracy and never was. Why do you think you can will something you don’t own or have any decision making powers at into something it never claimed to be and never was? Fix capitalism, or change our culture not to revolve around greed and maximizing profits, and the shit Apple does won’t happen. If there is a way to make more money, walled gardens to extract more money will always exist.
  - TheLoafOfBread 3y ago
    How do I use PWA with BLE on iOS? I can't unless I will use App Store and native application. So I have no choice but to use App Store.
    - wutwutwat 3y ago
      You have a choice, don’t make an iPhone app if you don’t want to deal with the App Store.
  - meibo 3y ago
    In my opinion, all of this falls apart once you consider that Apple has sabotaged the mobile web as an application platform basically since the inception of the iPhone. You actually just don't have a choice if you want to reach that audience, in a lot of cases. Heck, we only now just got Web Push which sort of kinda works sometimes on mobile Safari at the moment. I also disagree that every organization in a capitalist society has to be inherently evil, but that might be more of a fundamental discussion ;)
    - mediumsmart 3y ago
      Apple has sabotaged the mobile web as an application platform basically since the inception of the iPhone. There was a mobile web before the iPhone?
      - kristiandupont 3y ago
        That's fair but it doesn't refute GP's point. Things have improved vastly with the introduction of web push but Apple is still dragging their feet on making it possible to create a good mobile experience with web-only apps. Now, I generally don't like conspiracy theories and I seek not to attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity (or even a lack of attention, etc.) However, in this particular case it seems very obvious to me that Apple is doing it in order to force developers to build native apps.
  - paulddraper 3y ago

ksec 3y ago

>"If you run to the press and trash us, it never helps." The context is that Steve was still involve with Apple's decision. It is similar to a lot of things at Apple. They were there for a reason but it seems a lot of the context were gone once Steve was not there.

junofan 3y ago
Now that’s a dude who’d been around the block a few times. It’s just not worth it to do business with people who treat you like garbage. No matter how big you are or how small they are.