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When an addict reaches that point, they are almost certainly costing society resources. Not just being non-productive, but everything from social services to l

When an addict reaches that point, they are almost certainly costing society resources. Not just being non-productive, but everything from social services to law enforcement, they are costing the rest of us resources which would be better used as an investment in our collective future. Society has a legitimate interest in the problem.

pixl97 3y ago
Ah yes, the path of good intentions that leads to hell. "That point" is a nebulous term that has a very wide range of potential definitions. Also 'non-productive' is one of those terms that get bandied about by the worst of us as excuses to commit the worst acts against the other humans. I mean, in your idea, we should give up democracy and follow some kind of authoritarian system that perfectly optimizes our choices for 'the greater good'. We've seen this doesn't work out so well in practice as even "good upstanding citizens" are still greedy pieces of shit that will screw over their fellow human for another dollar.
- petsfed 3y ago
  >as even "good upstanding citizens" are still greedy pieces of shit that will screw over their fellow human for another dollar. I think a more charitable way to look at this is that whatever "good" is being pushed, hasn't really been sold effectively, or its being meted out unfairly or in a way that negates the "good". People are not greedy in a vacuum, they are greedy because they believe that failing to be so puts them at risk of losing resources they need. People in general don't horde toilet paper, but they definitely did when they thought their ability to get more toilet paper later was in danger.
junon 3y ago
What evidence do you have for this? Have you met an addict? Have you met a high functioning addict?
- rootusrootus 3y ago
  Are you suggesting that because high functioning addicts exist, we can just ignore the low functioning ones? What proportion of addicts are high functioning?
  - junon 3y ago
    That's so wildly far from my point.
lawlessone 3y ago
>When an addict reaches that point, they are almost certainly costing society resources. Not just being non-productive, but everything from social services to law enforcement, they are costing the rest of us resources which would be better used as an investment in our collective future. Society has a legitimate interest in the problem. I won't disagree or agree. My point is addiction isn't something people can just rationalize themselves out of by sitting down and thinking of a "greater good".

pixl97 3y ago

Ah yes, the path of good intentions that leads to hell. "That point" is a nebulous term that has a very wide range of potential definitions. Also 'non-productive' is one of those terms that get bandied about by the worst of us as excuses to commit the worst acts against the other humans. I mean, in your idea, we should give up democracy and follow some kind of authoritarian system that perfectly optimizes our choices for 'the greater good'. We've seen this doesn't work out so well in practice as even "good upstanding citizens" are still greedy pieces of shit that will screw over their fellow human for another dollar.

petsfed 3y ago
>as even "good upstanding citizens" are still greedy pieces of shit that will screw over their fellow human for another dollar. I think a more charitable way to look at this is that whatever "good" is being pushed, hasn't really been sold effectively, or its being meted out unfairly or in a way that negates the "good". People are not greedy in a vacuum, they are greedy because they believe that failing to be so puts them at risk of losing resources they need. People in general don't horde toilet paper, but they definitely did when they thought their ability to get more toilet paper later was in danger.

junon 3y ago

What evidence do you have for this? Have you met an addict? Have you met a high functioning addict?

rootusrootus 3y ago
Are you suggesting that because high functioning addicts exist, we can just ignore the low functioning ones? What proportion of addicts are high functioning?
- junon 3y ago
  That's so wildly far from my point.

lawlessone 3y ago

>When an addict reaches that point, they are almost certainly costing society resources. Not just being non-productive, but everything from social services to law enforcement, they are costing the rest of us resources which would be better used as an investment in our collective future. Society has a legitimate interest in the problem. I won't disagree or agree. My point is addiction isn't something people can just rationalize themselves out of by sitting down and thinking of a "greater good".