5 ms·

Your tone is snarls, but presumably you agree that better visibility on Musks failings as a human are net beneficial? Maybe we’re late to the party, but OP said

Your tone is snarls, but presumably you agree that better visibility on Musks failings as a human are net beneficial? Maybe we’re late to the party, but OP said ‘better visibility’ not ‘first inklings’

PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
I think if you were ok with his pedophile comments but drew the line at twitter that you have your priorities wrong. judging someone in that manner for a frickin' website but giving them a pass for calling someone a pedophile says more about you as a human being than it does Musk.
- bigfudge 3y ago
  yes, but let’s steel man this: I guess someone might not have been paying attention to twitter spats before and not understood the details and how gross the story was. The X shitshow is so public and obvious as to be unavoidable. And for that I’m grateful.
  - PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
    that same poster posted this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38882249 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38882249 Do you really believe they weren't following Musk and therefore had no idea about his pedophile comments? I just can't bring myself to care about what Musk is doing to twitter, but I've not been a fan of his since he made those comments and anyone who feels stronger about twitter than those comments doesn't have their priorities straight.
    - ryanklee 3y ago
      Of course I was aware. I've been of the opinion that Musk is a piece of shit since 2015. My point, which I stated very clearly and which you have chosen to ignore despite explicitly being pointed to it by the other poster, is that his takeover of Twitter has increased his exposure and it's clearer now to more people that he is a very problematic person.
      - PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
        I think you're a bit too deep there if you think what he's done with twitter should be cause for anyone to think deeply ill of him. and that's been _my_ point from the beginning.
        ryanklee 3y ago
        Again, you seem very intent on misreading very clear statements. I never claimed that what he did with Twitter is problematic (though it's very problematic), I said it raises the visibility of his behaviors.
        PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
        > I never claimed that what he did with Twitter is problematic (though it's very problematic) oh yeah, when you said his behavior around X raises the visibility of him it was ambiguous as to whether or not you were claiming it was problematic.... oh wait, no it wasn't, here's the quote > What we gained, though, is better visibility on one of the most toxic, wretched humans currently on our besieged Earth. No reasonable person reads that and thinks to themselves "man, I wonder if this person has an opinion on Elon Musk and whether it's positive or not!". As I've said already, my point is that anyone who was aware of his pedophile comments but drew the line at twitter has their priorities wrong and anyone who is not aware of his pedophile comments but is aware of twitter also has a perspective problem. You yourself are in entirely too deep, I suspect this is like porn for a certain personality, hence the amount of time you seem to be spending on Elon. Personally, I found his claim that remote work was immoral to be more problematic than anything he did at twitter. twitter was bog standard buy company, institute cost saving measures, move on. But some people were so enraged at him re-instating Trump's account that here we are now, with someone spending an unfathomably large amount of time worrying about someone who has no real effect on their life.
        bigfudge 3y ago
        > unfathomably large amount of time worrying about someone who has no real effect on their life. I think this is wrong. The way in which we conduct online debate does have material impact on our public life and policy. One example: if the shitshow that Twitter/X become changes the Overton window for what it's socially acceptable to say in public debate then that could be a net negative. It may be legal in the US to abuse and wish rape upon most women in public life but Elon's practical defence of that kind of free speech on his platform is in my view a net negative. Note, I'm not arguing that any particular type of speech should be banned — just that, given recent history, it seems that these kind of social norms are not self policing any more.

PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago

I think if you were ok with his pedophile comments but drew the line at twitter that you have your priorities wrong. judging someone in that manner for a frickin' website but giving them a pass for calling someone a pedophile says more about you as a human being than it does Musk.

bigfudge 3y ago
yes, but let’s steel man this: I guess someone might not have been paying attention to twitter spats before and not understood the details and how gross the story was. The X shitshow is so public and obvious as to be unavoidable. And for that I’m grateful.
- PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
  that same poster posted this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38882249 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38882249 Do you really believe they weren't following Musk and therefore had no idea about his pedophile comments? I just can't bring myself to care about what Musk is doing to twitter, but I've not been a fan of his since he made those comments and anyone who feels stronger about twitter than those comments doesn't have their priorities straight.
  - ryanklee 3y ago
    Of course I was aware. I've been of the opinion that Musk is a piece of shit since 2015. My point, which I stated very clearly and which you have chosen to ignore despite explicitly being pointed to it by the other poster, is that his takeover of Twitter has increased his exposure and it's clearer now to more people that he is a very problematic person.
    - PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
      I think you're a bit too deep there if you think what he's done with twitter should be cause for anyone to think deeply ill of him. and that's been _my_ point from the beginning.
      - ryanklee 3y ago
        Again, you seem very intent on misreading very clear statements. I never claimed that what he did with Twitter is problematic (though it's very problematic), I said it raises the visibility of his behaviors.
        PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
        > I never claimed that what he did with Twitter is problematic (though it's very problematic) oh yeah, when you said his behavior around X raises the visibility of him it was ambiguous as to whether or not you were claiming it was problematic.... oh wait, no it wasn't, here's the quote > What we gained, though, is better visibility on one of the most toxic, wretched humans currently on our besieged Earth. No reasonable person reads that and thinks to themselves "man, I wonder if this person has an opinion on Elon Musk and whether it's positive or not!". As I've said already, my point is that anyone who was aware of his pedophile comments but drew the line at twitter has their priorities wrong and anyone who is not aware of his pedophile comments but is aware of twitter also has a perspective problem. You yourself are in entirely too deep, I suspect this is like porn for a certain personality, hence the amount of time you seem to be spending on Elon. Personally, I found his claim that remote work was immoral to be more problematic than anything he did at twitter. twitter was bog standard buy company, institute cost saving measures, move on. But some people were so enraged at him re-instating Trump's account that here we are now, with someone spending an unfathomably large amount of time worrying about someone who has no real effect on their life.
        bigfudge 3y ago
        > unfathomably large amount of time worrying about someone who has no real effect on their life. I think this is wrong. The way in which we conduct online debate does have material impact on our public life and policy. One example: if the shitshow that Twitter/X become changes the Overton window for what it's socially acceptable to say in public debate then that could be a net negative. It may be legal in the US to abuse and wish rape upon most women in public life but Elon's practical defence of that kind of free speech on his platform is in my view a net negative. Note, I'm not arguing that any particular type of speech should be banned — just that, given recent history, it seems that these kind of social norms are not self policing any more.