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I don't know that we lost much; Twitter is was hugely problematic before Musk arrived. (The problems are not native to Twitter, but hip-shot social media in gen

I don't know that we lost much; Twitter is was hugely problematic before Musk arrived. (The problems are not native to Twitter, but hip-shot social media in general.) What we gained, though, is better visibility on one of the most toxic, wretched humans currently on our besieged Earth. It should be clear to everyone that Musk is a dangerous lunatic. And for those who are confused on this point, your judgement is very, very suspect.

PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
> What we gained, though, is better visibility on one of the most toxic, wretched humans currently on our besieged Earth. So it wasn't when he called the diver that was risking their life saving children in a cave a pedophile because said diver said the sub Elon was having built was never going to work? That isn't when we knew he was a terrible person, but when he took over twitter and renamed it?
- bigfudge 3y ago
  Your tone is snarls, but presumably you agree that better visibility on Musks failings as a human are net beneficial? Maybe we’re late to the party, but OP said ‘better visibility’ not ‘first inklings’
  - PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
    I think if you were ok with his pedophile comments but drew the line at twitter that you have your priorities wrong. judging someone in that manner for a frickin' website but giving them a pass for calling someone a pedophile says more about you as a human being than it does Musk.
    - bigfudge 3y ago
      yes, but let’s steel man this: I guess someone might not have been paying attention to twitter spats before and not understood the details and how gross the story was. The X shitshow is so public and obvious as to be unavoidable. And for that I’m grateful.
      - PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
        that same poster posted this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38882249 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38882249 Do you really believe they weren't following Musk and therefore had no idea about his pedophile comments? I just can't bring myself to care about what Musk is doing to twitter, but I've not been a fan of his since he made those comments and anyone who feels stronger about twitter than those comments doesn't have their priorities straight.
        ryanklee 3y ago
        Of course I was aware. I've been of the opinion that Musk is a piece of shit since 2015. My point, which I stated very clearly and which you have chosen to ignore despite explicitly being pointed to it by the other poster, is that his takeover of Twitter has increased his exposure and it's clearer now to more people that he is a very problematic person.
        PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
        I think you're a bit too deep there if you think what he's done with twitter should be cause for anyone to think deeply ill of him. and that's been _my_ point from the beginning.
        ryanklee 3y ago
        Again, you seem very intent on misreading very clear statements. I never claimed that what he did with Twitter is problematic (though it's very problematic), I said it raises the visibility of his behaviors.
        PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
        > I never claimed that what he did with Twitter is problematic (though it's very problematic) oh yeah, when you said his behavior around X raises the visibility of him it was ambiguous as to whether or not you were claiming it was problematic.... oh wait, no it wasn't, here's the quote > What we gained, though, is better visibility on one of the most toxic, wretched humans currently on our besieged Earth. No reasonable person reads that and thinks to themselves "man, I wonder if this person has an opinion on Elon Musk and whether it's positive or not!". As I've said already, my point is that anyone who was aware of his pedophile comments but drew the line at twitter has their priorities wrong and anyone who is not aware of his pedophile comments but is aware of twitter also has a perspective problem. You yourself are in entirely too deep, I suspect this is like porn for a certain personality, hence the amount of time you seem to be spending on Elon. Personally, I found his claim that remote work was immoral to be more problematic than anything he did at twitter. twitter was bog standard buy company, institute cost saving measures, move on. But some people were so enraged at him re-instating Trump's account that here we are now, with someone spending an unfathomably large amount of time worrying about someone who has no real effect on their life.
VirusNewbie 3y ago
>is better visibility on one of the most toxic, wretched humans currently on our besieged Earth. When I see this kind of emotional response I immediately lose all respect for someone. Instead of taking the time to explain what the person did wrong, they result to hyperbole?
- golemotron 3y ago
  It's scapegoating driven by ressentiment.
  - nemo 3y ago
    Can you understand why some might feel resentment towards a wealthy billionaire capriciously abusing his wealth and power to be a glaring, overt mortal failure? If you look at the absolutely pathetic figure he cuts as a moral agent in the universe and think he's doing well, your values far out of the mainstream and to the far extremes. This is illustrated by the pullout of advertisers then he began posting anitsemitic hate and doubled down on it. Once that happened, the advertisers that were left bailed out because they are rational agents who recognize that Musk's brand of extremism is unpopular and toxic to their brands. He might be an ok engineer, and he's a talented enough business manager, and some of his businesses might serve some public good, but he's still a deeply flawed moral agent making moral choices very clearly driven by hatred, ignorance, and greed. Also, whatever blaming Musk for his moral failings might be, it's not scapegoating. A scapegoat is by definition innocent. Musk is anything but that.
    - VirusNewbie 3y ago
      I don't particularly have strong opinions one way or another about Musk's behavior, and certainly don't understand how you could claim he's "abusing his wealth". I can think of many other companies and rich owners who have done much worse things, so it's surprising people seem so passionate about Elon. Given he apologized for his Tweet that had accusations of anti-semitism, is your main evidence of him being awful is that advertiseres pulled out of the platform? From what I understand, some of them are back. Will you retract your hatred if they all return?
foofie 3y ago
> I don't know that we lost much; Eliminating moderation to allow hate speech and disinformation to run free and turning the verified account feature into a mockery were considerable blows to the platform's relevance, as proven by the drop in ad revenue. You can argue things were not good, but it's not up for discussion whether Elon Musk's takeover of Twitter didn't turned it into shit.

PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago

> What we gained, though, is better visibility on one of the most toxic, wretched humans currently on our besieged Earth. So it wasn't when he called the diver that was risking their life saving children in a cave a pedophile because said diver said the sub Elon was having built was never going to work? That isn't when we knew he was a terrible person, but when he took over twitter and renamed it?

bigfudge 3y ago
Your tone is snarls, but presumably you agree that better visibility on Musks failings as a human are net beneficial? Maybe we’re late to the party, but OP said ‘better visibility’ not ‘first inklings’
- PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
  I think if you were ok with his pedophile comments but drew the line at twitter that you have your priorities wrong. judging someone in that manner for a frickin' website but giving them a pass for calling someone a pedophile says more about you as a human being than it does Musk.
  - bigfudge 3y ago
    yes, but let’s steel man this: I guess someone might not have been paying attention to twitter spats before and not understood the details and how gross the story was. The X shitshow is so public and obvious as to be unavoidable. And for that I’m grateful.
    - PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
      that same poster posted this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38882249 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38882249 Do you really believe they weren't following Musk and therefore had no idea about his pedophile comments? I just can't bring myself to care about what Musk is doing to twitter, but I've not been a fan of his since he made those comments and anyone who feels stronger about twitter than those comments doesn't have their priorities straight.
      - ryanklee 3y ago
        Of course I was aware. I've been of the opinion that Musk is a piece of shit since 2015. My point, which I stated very clearly and which you have chosen to ignore despite explicitly being pointed to it by the other poster, is that his takeover of Twitter has increased his exposure and it's clearer now to more people that he is a very problematic person.
        PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
        I think you're a bit too deep there if you think what he's done with twitter should be cause for anyone to think deeply ill of him. and that's been _my_ point from the beginning.
        ryanklee 3y ago
        Again, you seem very intent on misreading very clear statements. I never claimed that what he did with Twitter is problematic (though it's very problematic), I said it raises the visibility of his behaviors.
        PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y ago
        > I never claimed that what he did with Twitter is problematic (though it's very problematic) oh yeah, when you said his behavior around X raises the visibility of him it was ambiguous as to whether or not you were claiming it was problematic.... oh wait, no it wasn't, here's the quote > What we gained, though, is better visibility on one of the most toxic, wretched humans currently on our besieged Earth. No reasonable person reads that and thinks to themselves "man, I wonder if this person has an opinion on Elon Musk and whether it's positive or not!". As I've said already, my point is that anyone who was aware of his pedophile comments but drew the line at twitter has their priorities wrong and anyone who is not aware of his pedophile comments but is aware of twitter also has a perspective problem. You yourself are in entirely too deep, I suspect this is like porn for a certain personality, hence the amount of time you seem to be spending on Elon. Personally, I found his claim that remote work was immoral to be more problematic than anything he did at twitter. twitter was bog standard buy company, institute cost saving measures, move on. But some people were so enraged at him re-instating Trump's account that here we are now, with someone spending an unfathomably large amount of time worrying about someone who has no real effect on their life.

VirusNewbie 3y ago

>is better visibility on one of the most toxic, wretched humans currently on our besieged Earth. When I see this kind of emotional response I immediately lose all respect for someone. Instead of taking the time to explain what the person did wrong, they result to hyperbole?

golemotron 3y ago
It's scapegoating driven by ressentiment.
- nemo 3y ago
  Can you understand why some might feel resentment towards a wealthy billionaire capriciously abusing his wealth and power to be a glaring, overt mortal failure? If you look at the absolutely pathetic figure he cuts as a moral agent in the universe and think he's doing well, your values far out of the mainstream and to the far extremes. This is illustrated by the pullout of advertisers then he began posting anitsemitic hate and doubled down on it. Once that happened, the advertisers that were left bailed out because they are rational agents who recognize that Musk's brand of extremism is unpopular and toxic to their brands. He might be an ok engineer, and he's a talented enough business manager, and some of his businesses might serve some public good, but he's still a deeply flawed moral agent making moral choices very clearly driven by hatred, ignorance, and greed. Also, whatever blaming Musk for his moral failings might be, it's not scapegoating. A scapegoat is by definition innocent. Musk is anything but that.
  - VirusNewbie 3y ago
    I don't particularly have strong opinions one way or another about Musk's behavior, and certainly don't understand how you could claim he's "abusing his wealth". I can think of many other companies and rich owners who have done much worse things, so it's surprising people seem so passionate about Elon. Given he apologized for his Tweet that had accusations of anti-semitism, is your main evidence of him being awful is that advertiseres pulled out of the platform? From what I understand, some of them are back. Will you retract your hatred if they all return?

foofie 3y ago

> I don't know that we lost much; Eliminating moderation to allow hate speech and disinformation to run free and turning the verified account feature into a mockery were considerable blows to the platform's relevance, as proven by the drop in ad revenue. You can argue things were not good, but it's not up for discussion whether Elon Musk's takeover of Twitter didn't turned it into shit.