4 ms·

Who wants to stick around through the apocalypse? What event would be a) well in advance with time to transit to NZ or Hawaii b) require a bunker rather than j

Who wants to stick around through the apocalypse? What event would be a) well in advance with time to transit to NZ or Hawaii b) require a bunker rather than just isolating in your estate and c) what is the long game assuming society collapses?

dist-epoch 3y ago
Global nuclear war, pandemic with fatality rate >25%, AI take over.
- pc86 3y ago
  Presumably the AI will know where all the bunkers are, unless some of these billionaires are so paranoid they make the contractors use all paper records. Come to think of it, probably at least one or two are that paranoid.
  - dist-epoch 3y ago
    Sure, but you still have a better chance in NZ than in US. And you'll still have to deal with the other people panicking in an AI scenario. Maybe the AI doesn't particularly care about you, but civilization still collapses.
  - nytesky 3y ago
    Can you imagine the complexity of hiding a bunker digitally? Starts with paper records. Then no phones on crew working the site, no gps devices probably, surveillance satellite records would need to be avoided… on and on.
- SketchySeaBeast 3y ago
  What AI? ChatGPT? Is the final remnant of humanity going to be a blinking prompt on a screen in the blackened ruins of a dead civilization? Or is Skynet out there already and we just don't know about it?
kypro 3y ago
If you're wealthy and civilisation collapses then nothing is preventing you from emerging as a monarch if you wish. Assuming you have enough guns, food and personal you'll basically be able to do whatever the hell you want in a lawless society.
- SketchySeaBeast 3y ago
  But you need people to use those guns. And those people need to stay loyal. Sure, you have stuff, but how do you keep your stuff safe from others who are bettered skilled at taking your stuff?
  - gruez 3y ago
    How did the monarchs of europe stay in power?
    - rwmj 3y ago
      They appealed to "god says I'm the monarch", plus personal charisma, plus playing off one group against another group. There also existed a state and laws, even if primitive compared to what we have today. Even so I doubt it was an easy thing being a European monarch.
      - RetroTechie 3y ago
        Besides: no doubt being in a ruler's private army had its perks. A stable job, status, coins etc. Iirc not rarely a ruler met its demise after failing to pay their mercenaries.
    - SketchySeaBeast 3y ago
      A whole social structure was built up and around them. When they took power the board was largely already set. When societal unrest hit the people who were at the top tended to change. I don't think the uber powerful building bunkers will be able to change that.
    - 3y ago
pc86 3y ago
I think a big part of these bunkers is just that these folks have SO much money they can afford to spend millions or hundreds of millions just in case. And part of making it so "nice" is that it's not really a "get a text about the world ending in Cali and hop a flight to Hawaii" it's "get a text about anything in Hawaii and drive to the bunker." I'm sure the main estate has security and amenities too, but in some sort of eat-the-rich social disturbance, geographic isolation is extraordinarily valuable. To your last point, I think the long game is actually the same as all the typical end of the world movies and fantastical zombie apocalypse things - just survive. Assuming some sort of societal collapse, regardless of how long it lasts, the idea is just to survive another day and that's going to be a hell of a lot easier behind some thick concrete walls in an island in the middle of the Pacific than it is in suburban California.
rwmj 3y ago
What interests me is how he's going to incentivise his guards to keep guarding him, after an apocalypse that wipes out both his money and the usefulness of money itself.
- pintxo 3y ago
  You will be down to Leadership/Charisma. So better only hire introvert guards.
- hattmall 3y ago
  Presumably the bunker would have significant stores of food and supplies with which to pay them and offer protection for their families. Additionally there would also be the promise of eventually getting to other bunkers that he has with more supplies and people. Which may or may not exist.
  - rwmj 3y ago
    Or they will take the food and supplies by force and give him no choice but to reveal the location of the other bunkers.
  - latentcall 3y ago
    I think armed security will be able to get their own food from the stores. No single man no matter who they are in a SHTF scenario could realistically convince enough people to keep them safe. In fact his security would be the ones with all the power, he would have none.
    - benterix 3y ago
      This can make him up at night. He needs to come up with a very convincing way of promising them some more resources that cannot be just grabbed by torturing him. It's not going to be easy. In traditional setups you have a higher reason such as protecting the president for the sake of the whole nation etc., with Zuck you have none.
    - kobalsky 3y ago
troyvit 3y ago
I'm not one of these guys, but what I imagine is that it's purely ego-driven. They just see themselves as too important to die in squalor with the rest of the masses. When "the end" comes their estate would be too vulnerable compared to a protected bunker. The one in the article will apparently include 30 offices, so I imagine he'll make sure social media will emerge from the other side of the apocalypse, so expect lots of selfies with people holding their enemy's head and howling at the moon? The last thing is I bet these guys at least feel connected enough to get more advance warning than the normals.
- toomuchtodo 3y ago
  Can you imagine trying to hold stand ups and drive product in a post apocalyptic world at what's left of Meta? Tremendous. "Netflix! You're green lit!" The parody writes itself.
- s1artibartfast 3y ago
  >I'm not one of these guys, but what I imagine is that it's purely ego-driven. They just see themselves as too important to die in squalor with the rest of the masses. I struggle to understand where you are coming from. Do you want to die in squaller with the rest of the masses? If you are in a tower on fire, do you not want to leave and survive?
  - troyvit 3y ago
    I see where you're coming from. To me we all _are_ figuratively in a tower on fire. The fire's just started, but nobody's doing much about it. As one of the masses I try to do my part in my personal and professional life. The oligarchs and plutocrats might have the collective power to put out that fire, but they'd rather take a fire escape. I say that, but I bet they donate more to different causes than I'll see in a lifetime. So -- who am I to fault them for hedging their bets right?
houseatrielah 3y ago
I think you just have to wait until everybody starves and the radiation from the nukes is not so bad. Not sure what you do after that. Hunt deer? Fly to South America? Hawaii is a uniquely terrible bug-out spot because its a highly valuable naval asset right between the warring superpowers, hard to get to and hard to leave. My billionaire bug out location would be Patagonia.
tivert 3y ago
> Who wants to stick around through the apocalypse? Me. I have kids that I love, and I want them to survive, not die.
- s1artibartfast 3y ago
  You must mean you "want them to survive". I find it interesting that there seems to be such a big cultural divide on the topic.
  - tivert 3y ago
    > You must mean you "want them to survive". Yes, I noticed my typo and fixed it.

dist-epoch 3y ago

Global nuclear war, pandemic with fatality rate >25%, AI take over.

pc86 3y ago
Presumably the AI will know where all the bunkers are, unless some of these billionaires are so paranoid they make the contractors use all paper records. Come to think of it, probably at least one or two are that paranoid.
- dist-epoch 3y ago
  Sure, but you still have a better chance in NZ than in US. And you'll still have to deal with the other people panicking in an AI scenario. Maybe the AI doesn't particularly care about you, but civilization still collapses.
- nytesky 3y ago
  Can you imagine the complexity of hiding a bunker digitally? Starts with paper records. Then no phones on crew working the site, no gps devices probably, surveillance satellite records would need to be avoided… on and on.
SketchySeaBeast 3y ago
What AI? ChatGPT? Is the final remnant of humanity going to be a blinking prompt on a screen in the blackened ruins of a dead civilization? Or is Skynet out there already and we just don't know about it?

kypro 3y ago

If you're wealthy and civilisation collapses then nothing is preventing you from emerging as a monarch if you wish. Assuming you have enough guns, food and personal you'll basically be able to do whatever the hell you want in a lawless society.

SketchySeaBeast 3y ago
But you need people to use those guns. And those people need to stay loyal. Sure, you have stuff, but how do you keep your stuff safe from others who are bettered skilled at taking your stuff?
- gruez 3y ago
  How did the monarchs of europe stay in power?
  - rwmj 3y ago
    They appealed to "god says I'm the monarch", plus personal charisma, plus playing off one group against another group. There also existed a state and laws, even if primitive compared to what we have today. Even so I doubt it was an easy thing being a European monarch.
    - RetroTechie 3y ago
      Besides: no doubt being in a ruler's private army had its perks. A stable job, status, coins etc. Iirc not rarely a ruler met its demise after failing to pay their mercenaries.
  - SketchySeaBeast 3y ago
    A whole social structure was built up and around them. When they took power the board was largely already set. When societal unrest hit the people who were at the top tended to change. I don't think the uber powerful building bunkers will be able to change that.
  - 3y ago

pc86 3y ago

I think a big part of these bunkers is just that these folks have SO much money they can afford to spend millions or hundreds of millions just in case. And part of making it so "nice" is that it's not really a "get a text about the world ending in Cali and hop a flight to Hawaii" it's "get a text about anything in Hawaii and drive to the bunker." I'm sure the main estate has security and amenities too, but in some sort of eat-the-rich social disturbance, geographic isolation is extraordinarily valuable. To your last point, I think the long game is actually the same as all the typical end of the world movies and fantastical zombie apocalypse things - just survive. Assuming some sort of societal collapse, regardless of how long it lasts, the idea is just to survive another day and that's going to be a hell of a lot easier behind some thick concrete walls in an island in the middle of the Pacific than it is in suburban California.

rwmj 3y ago

What interests me is how he's going to incentivise his guards to keep guarding him, after an apocalypse that wipes out both his money and the usefulness of money itself.

pintxo 3y ago
You will be down to Leadership/Charisma. So better only hire introvert guards.
hattmall 3y ago
Presumably the bunker would have significant stores of food and supplies with which to pay them and offer protection for their families. Additionally there would also be the promise of eventually getting to other bunkers that he has with more supplies and people. Which may or may not exist.
- rwmj 3y ago
  Or they will take the food and supplies by force and give him no choice but to reveal the location of the other bunkers.
- latentcall 3y ago
  I think armed security will be able to get their own food from the stores. No single man no matter who they are in a SHTF scenario could realistically convince enough people to keep them safe. In fact his security would be the ones with all the power, he would have none.
  - benterix 3y ago
    This can make him up at night. He needs to come up with a very convincing way of promising them some more resources that cannot be just grabbed by torturing him. It's not going to be easy. In traditional setups you have a higher reason such as protecting the president for the sake of the whole nation etc., with Zuck you have none.
  - kobalsky 3y ago

troyvit 3y ago

I'm not one of these guys, but what I imagine is that it's purely ego-driven. They just see themselves as too important to die in squalor with the rest of the masses. When "the end" comes their estate would be too vulnerable compared to a protected bunker. The one in the article will apparently include 30 offices, so I imagine he'll make sure social media will emerge from the other side of the apocalypse, so expect lots of selfies with people holding their enemy's head and howling at the moon? The last thing is I bet these guys at least feel connected enough to get more advance warning than the normals.

toomuchtodo 3y ago
Can you imagine trying to hold stand ups and drive product in a post apocalyptic world at what's left of Meta? Tremendous. "Netflix! You're green lit!" The parody writes itself.
s1artibartfast 3y ago
>I'm not one of these guys, but what I imagine is that it's purely ego-driven. They just see themselves as too important to die in squalor with the rest of the masses. I struggle to understand where you are coming from. Do you want to die in squaller with the rest of the masses? If you are in a tower on fire, do you not want to leave and survive?
- troyvit 3y ago
  I see where you're coming from. To me we all _are_ figuratively in a tower on fire. The fire's just started, but nobody's doing much about it. As one of the masses I try to do my part in my personal and professional life. The oligarchs and plutocrats might have the collective power to put out that fire, but they'd rather take a fire escape. I say that, but I bet they donate more to different causes than I'll see in a lifetime. So -- who am I to fault them for hedging their bets right?

houseatrielah 3y ago

I think you just have to wait until everybody starves and the radiation from the nukes is not so bad. Not sure what you do after that. Hunt deer? Fly to South America? Hawaii is a uniquely terrible bug-out spot because its a highly valuable naval asset right between the warring superpowers, hard to get to and hard to leave. My billionaire bug out location would be Patagonia.

tivert 3y ago

> Who wants to stick around through the apocalypse? Me. I have kids that I love, and I want them to survive, not die.

s1artibartfast 3y ago
You must mean you "want them to survive". I find it interesting that there seems to be such a big cultural divide on the topic.
- tivert 3y ago
  > You must mean you "want them to survive". Yes, I noticed my typo and fixed it.