14 ms·

Nov’22 is very recent, and won’t be your experience forever. It’s been a little over 20 years for me. Now, I get background checked every year. It doesn’t show.

by nope00 3y ago

Nov’22 is very recent, and won’t be your experience forever. It’s been a little over 20 years for me. Now, I get background checked every year. It doesn’t show. Initially I worked in food service and on phpfreelancer. I spun that into consistent consulting work until a client offered a full time position (less than 15 people, no background checks). As the years rolled by, I kept moving around. Eventually I tried at a large company(around 8 years ago) and nothing showed on the background check. I do NOT recommend being upfront, unless there are no formal procedures in place and being honest actually helps. We are talking about your ability to feed and shelter yourself, so give up on the “honesty” thing. I have -never- been able to provide for myself after having been “honest”. [edit: after reading felonintexas let me update this. If someone point blank asks, tell them. Don’t volunteer this information. There is nothing to be gained] Also, you are now an edge case. That means most advice doesn’t apply. This is both exciting and horribly anxiety driving at the same time. You will have to become comfortable blazing your own path and doing things others say is not possible. Seriously, good luck. It is possible. It is amazing what you can do that everyone else thinks can’t be done.

tonetegeatinst 3y ago
Not a felon but grew up with everyone telling us that colleges would search our social media etc. A friend told me that the 2 important rules to surviving corporate environments is the following in no specific order. 1. Never lie to someone, and own what you did. Wordsmithing is a gray area but never lie, the reputation of not being truthful can follow you for decades. 2. Never volunteer information that isn't specifically asked for. This isn't a free pass to not provide critical info when your working on stuff like a project, but keep in mind that HR always can dig up info when they want to fire you or not offer you a job. Be honest and to the point, but don't volunteer info that can put you in a bad spot. TLDR: if they don't ask, don't tell. But if they ask, be honest
- bfuller 3y ago
  tell the truth, but don't always be telling it
- justsomeoldguy 3y ago
  sounds reasonable, but I can't tell you how combative it is if you're applying for a job in a state that forbids them from asking if you have any felonies, and there it is on the job application, staring you in the face. so what are you going to do, tell them no? you won't get the job. tell the truth? you won't get the job. sue them? good luck. you'll need it and that does not get you the job and the settlement, if you were to win is years away, so there is no remedy. you start out combative, it's over. there is frequently just no way to win since the ones paying are the ones not following the rules.
  - dharmab 3y ago
    No need to sue. You can notify the state Department of Labor and move on.
    - justsomeoldguy 3y ago
      Didn't know that. Also was too emotionally distraught to really deal with it in a logical manner. I had a lot of stuff going on, I was about to get off parole 3 years early. I absolutely needed a job. Anyways, I found a good one after. And it was good for 2 years.
  - voxic11 3y ago
    You don't need to sue, you should file a complaint with your states department of labor or whomever is charged with enforcing your states labor laws, they will sue for you if they think you have a case. Also in every state I have seen with a similar law the law specifically says you are allowed to lie if you are asked that question anyways and the employer is not allowed to run a background check on you before they offer you the job so your lie cannot be discovered before the job offer is made (and after its made your lie cannot be used against you and the offer cannot be rescinded without a written evaluation that explains why the specifics in your background check make you incompatible with the specific job you were offered). So I would just lie about it and if you don't get the job or the offer gets unfairly rescinded then report it to your department of labor. Guidance for New York City which is a locality with such a law: > Job applications cannot have questions about criminal records and cannot ask you to authorize a background check. Employers cannot ask you questions about your criminal record. If you are asked about your record, your answer cannot be used against you. Employers cannot run a background check on you until after a conditional offer of employment. > Once an employer offers you a job, they can ask about and consider your criminal record ...an employer can decide to not hire you for one of two reasons: 1. because a direct relationship exists between your conviction and the job you want; or 2. because your conviction history creates an unreasonable risk to people or property. The employer must send you its reasoning in writing, along with the background check it used. https://www.nyc.gov/site/cchr/media/fair-chance-employees.page https://www.nyc.gov/site/cchr/media/fair-chance-employees.pa...
- mr_o47 3y ago
  Best Advice, Honestly, Don't tell when its not asked
gwbas1c 3y ago
> [edit: after reading felonintexas let me update this. If someone point blank asks, tell them. Don’t volunteer this information. There is nothing to be gained] My Fraternity's cook, when I was in college, was a former fellon. He worked for us for a few years before he told me about his background. I don't remember the details, but we had a conversation where he mentioned he had experience in IT. Eventually he very briefly mentioned some high level details about his criminal record when the conversation drifted around "so if you were making big bucks, why are you now cooking for us?" I personally appreciate that he warned me about the consequences of the super-illegal (but "grey morality") thing he did. But, I must agree, it's best to keep things like a record quiet as long as possible. I don't know if other fraternity brothers knew about his background. It seems like the kind of thing that would be kept quiet until someone started veering into the super-illegal (but "grey morality") area that got our cook in trouble.
- busyant 3y ago
  > the super-illegal (but "grey morality") thing he did I'm curious to know what he did given your description. I can think of examples of the reverse: quasi-illegal, but quite immoral.
  - WatchDog 3y ago
    Not the parent commenter, but I would imagine something involving narcotics.
  - smsm42 3y ago
    Drugs? Contraband? Tax evasion? Insider trading? Industrial espionage? Any process crime like "lying to a fed"? If you think about it, we have tons of laws that don't fit into the mold of "hurting specific people" - which would definitely be "black morality" to me - but are more of either "preserving the system as it is" or even "we said it's illegal and so it is". I'm not saying none of those should exist, but I definitely would be willing to look onto some of it as a morally "gray area".
    - kridsdale1 3y ago
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
NoZebra120vClip 3y ago
26 years ago, I was charged with a felony in CA. I pled nolo contendre to a misdemeanor and received court probation; no other penalties. I recently underwent an extensive background check with my longtime employer and the case still showed up. Of course I had allocuted to it in advance and it was not a problem.
- mattclarkdotnet 3y ago
  I was hiring for a role in Australia, and had to sign off an exception because the preferred candidate had an unpaid speeding ticket in California. On the other hand we definitely hired people without speeding tickets who were likely deep agents for foreign states.
  - theGnuMe 3y ago
    makes ya think doesn't it..
Simon_ORourke 3y ago
> I do NOT recommend being upfront, unless there are no formal procedures in place and being honest actually helps. We are talking about your ability to feed and shelter yourself, so give up on the “honesty” thing. I have -never- been able to provide for myself after having been “honest”. [edit: after reading felonintexas let me update this. If someone point blank asks, tell them. Don’t volunteer this information. There is nothing to be gained] No better advice has ever been given on HN, from minor things to major stuff. Never volunteer any information about yourself to anyone in the office beyond what is required to complete your job. Never say too much about previous roles and keep it very general.
- tommychillfiger 3y ago
  I'm generally someone who sees honesty as a virtue and have always been fairly open, at work and in my private life. I'm curious if you can expand on this a bit - i.e., why is it a disadvantage and what sort of pitfalls can it lead to? I've been in analytics for a few years now, and it seems like it has mostly been an advantage for me, but it's certainly possible I just don't know what I don't know.
  - Simon_ORourke 3y ago
    Example - about 2005 I was a junior dev thinking I was about to make the cut to senior within the year, in a medium sized IT company. Let it slip accidentally to my boss that I used to install servers in racks in a previous role. Ended up being shoved into a "lateral move" into the systems engineering team because they couldn't hire quickly enough. Fast forward another six months and I get laid off after a migration to the cloud makes my team redundant. Expensive lesson, but lesson learned.
    - tommychillfiger 3y ago
      Okay, this is a useful example as it's salient for me. Especially as a relatively recent pivoter into tech, I've been willing to jump on whatever is needed and generally am able to figure things out and make it work. In my current position, at a small SaaS with layoffs and churn, this has led to me basically owning 3-4 roles' worth of tasks. Mostly completely unrelated to one another and very stressful due to the constant context switching. I appreciate your perspective here, this is something concrete I can work on.
HenryBemis 3y ago
> I do NOT recommend being upfront I re-binged "Last Week Tonight" a month ago. There is an episode on the prison system in the USA and the obstacles people face upon release. I remember one case where the person wrote on his job application as employed by the "State of <insert state>" while he was in prison. (it must be this episode: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Pz3syET3DY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Pz3syET3DY). I haven't been convicted of any crimes, so I don't have own experience. From people I know, they continued working in tech as contractors/freelancers, but for small fry (as big banks will be very thorough on your background (criminal/credit scoring) checks). Doing small gigs for small companies where you don't handle personal/sensitive data can give you enough time to (as the parent suggests) have this 'forgotten'. Would you consider moving to another country?
- lazyasciiart 3y ago
  A felony will block migration through most channels.
- aghastnj 3y ago
  When you say "big banks" you're actually crossing several regulatory domains. But as an example, here's the FINRA page on what they won't allow: https://www.finra.org/rules-guidance/guidance/eligibility-requirements https://www.finra.org/rules-guidance/guidance/eligibility-re... FINRA (Financial Industry Regulatory Authority) is the public face of the USA's "Securities and Exchange Commission". They write the rulebook on who gets to work in the industry (stockbrokers, investment bankers, and the like).
austin-cheney 3y ago
I have spent a good portion of my career with security clearances. If there is a background check that involves sending actual humans out to perform interviews then be absolutely up front about everything because they are going to discover it anyways. In this context being upfront saves lots of time whereas the opposite could result in additional investigations you don’t want. If it’s just some mom and pop shop then I fully agree. Just tell them enough to fully and honestly answer their questions without opening additional causes for concern.

by nope00 3y ago

tonetegeatinst 3y ago

Not a felon but grew up with everyone telling us that colleges would search our social media etc. A friend told me that the 2 important rules to surviving corporate environments is the following in no specific order. 1. Never lie to someone, and own what you did. Wordsmithing is a gray area but never lie, the reputation of not being truthful can follow you for decades. 2. Never volunteer information that isn't specifically asked for. This isn't a free pass to not provide critical info when your working on stuff like a project, but keep in mind that HR always can dig up info when they want to fire you or not offer you a job. Be honest and to the point, but don't volunteer info that can put you in a bad spot. TLDR: if they don't ask, don't tell. But if they ask, be honest

bfuller 3y ago
tell the truth, but don't always be telling it
justsomeoldguy 3y ago
sounds reasonable, but I can't tell you how combative it is if you're applying for a job in a state that forbids them from asking if you have any felonies, and there it is on the job application, staring you in the face. so what are you going to do, tell them no? you won't get the job. tell the truth? you won't get the job. sue them? good luck. you'll need it and that does not get you the job and the settlement, if you were to win is years away, so there is no remedy. you start out combative, it's over. there is frequently just no way to win since the ones paying are the ones not following the rules.
- dharmab 3y ago
  No need to sue. You can notify the state Department of Labor and move on.
  - justsomeoldguy 3y ago
    Didn't know that. Also was too emotionally distraught to really deal with it in a logical manner. I had a lot of stuff going on, I was about to get off parole 3 years early. I absolutely needed a job. Anyways, I found a good one after. And it was good for 2 years.
- voxic11 3y ago
  You don't need to sue, you should file a complaint with your states department of labor or whomever is charged with enforcing your states labor laws, they will sue for you if they think you have a case. Also in every state I have seen with a similar law the law specifically says you are allowed to lie if you are asked that question anyways and the employer is not allowed to run a background check on you before they offer you the job so your lie cannot be discovered before the job offer is made (and after its made your lie cannot be used against you and the offer cannot be rescinded without a written evaluation that explains why the specifics in your background check make you incompatible with the specific job you were offered). So I would just lie about it and if you don't get the job or the offer gets unfairly rescinded then report it to your department of labor. Guidance for New York City which is a locality with such a law: > Job applications cannot have questions about criminal records and cannot ask you to authorize a background check. Employers cannot ask you questions about your criminal record. If you are asked about your record, your answer cannot be used against you. Employers cannot run a background check on you until after a conditional offer of employment. > Once an employer offers you a job, they can ask about and consider your criminal record ...an employer can decide to not hire you for one of two reasons: 1. because a direct relationship exists between your conviction and the job you want; or 2. because your conviction history creates an unreasonable risk to people or property. The employer must send you its reasoning in writing, along with the background check it used. https://www.nyc.gov/site/cchr/media/fair-chance-employees.page https://www.nyc.gov/site/cchr/media/fair-chance-employees.pa...
mr_o47 3y ago
Best Advice, Honestly, Don't tell when its not asked

gwbas1c 3y ago

> [edit: after reading felonintexas let me update this. If someone point blank asks, tell them. Don’t volunteer this information. There is nothing to be gained] My Fraternity's cook, when I was in college, was a former fellon. He worked for us for a few years before he told me about his background. I don't remember the details, but we had a conversation where he mentioned he had experience in IT. Eventually he very briefly mentioned some high level details about his criminal record when the conversation drifted around "so if you were making big bucks, why are you now cooking for us?" I personally appreciate that he warned me about the consequences of the super-illegal (but "grey morality") thing he did. But, I must agree, it's best to keep things like a record quiet as long as possible. I don't know if other fraternity brothers knew about his background. It seems like the kind of thing that would be kept quiet until someone started veering into the super-illegal (but "grey morality") area that got our cook in trouble.

busyant 3y ago
> the super-illegal (but "grey morality") thing he did I'm curious to know what he did given your description. I can think of examples of the reverse: quasi-illegal, but quite immoral.
- WatchDog 3y ago
  Not the parent commenter, but I would imagine something involving narcotics.
- smsm42 3y ago
  Drugs? Contraband? Tax evasion? Insider trading? Industrial espionage? Any process crime like "lying to a fed"? If you think about it, we have tons of laws that don't fit into the mold of "hurting specific people" - which would definitely be "black morality" to me - but are more of either "preserving the system as it is" or even "we said it's illegal and so it is". I'm not saying none of those should exist, but I definitely would be willing to look onto some of it as a morally "gray area".
  - kridsdale1 3y ago

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

NoZebra120vClip 3y ago

26 years ago, I was charged with a felony in CA. I pled nolo contendre to a misdemeanor and received court probation; no other penalties. I recently underwent an extensive background check with my longtime employer and the case still showed up. Of course I had allocuted to it in advance and it was not a problem.

mattclarkdotnet 3y ago
I was hiring for a role in Australia, and had to sign off an exception because the preferred candidate had an unpaid speeding ticket in California. On the other hand we definitely hired people without speeding tickets who were likely deep agents for foreign states.
- theGnuMe 3y ago
  makes ya think doesn't it..

Simon_ORourke 3y ago

> I do NOT recommend being upfront, unless there are no formal procedures in place and being honest actually helps. We are talking about your ability to feed and shelter yourself, so give up on the “honesty” thing. I have -never- been able to provide for myself after having been “honest”. [edit: after reading felonintexas let me update this. If someone point blank asks, tell them. Don’t volunteer this information. There is nothing to be gained] No better advice has ever been given on HN, from minor things to major stuff. Never volunteer any information about yourself to anyone in the office beyond what is required to complete your job. Never say too much about previous roles and keep it very general.

tommychillfiger 3y ago
I'm generally someone who sees honesty as a virtue and have always been fairly open, at work and in my private life. I'm curious if you can expand on this a bit - i.e., why is it a disadvantage and what sort of pitfalls can it lead to? I've been in analytics for a few years now, and it seems like it has mostly been an advantage for me, but it's certainly possible I just don't know what I don't know.
- Simon_ORourke 3y ago
  Example - about 2005 I was a junior dev thinking I was about to make the cut to senior within the year, in a medium sized IT company. Let it slip accidentally to my boss that I used to install servers in racks in a previous role. Ended up being shoved into a "lateral move" into the systems engineering team because they couldn't hire quickly enough. Fast forward another six months and I get laid off after a migration to the cloud makes my team redundant. Expensive lesson, but lesson learned.
  - tommychillfiger 3y ago
    Okay, this is a useful example as it's salient for me. Especially as a relatively recent pivoter into tech, I've been willing to jump on whatever is needed and generally am able to figure things out and make it work. In my current position, at a small SaaS with layoffs and churn, this has led to me basically owning 3-4 roles' worth of tasks. Mostly completely unrelated to one another and very stressful due to the constant context switching. I appreciate your perspective here, this is something concrete I can work on.

HenryBemis 3y ago

> I do NOT recommend being upfront I re-binged "Last Week Tonight" a month ago. There is an episode on the prison system in the USA and the obstacles people face upon release. I remember one case where the person wrote on his job application as employed by the "State of <insert state>" while he was in prison. (it must be this episode: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Pz3syET3DY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Pz3syET3DY). I haven't been convicted of any crimes, so I don't have own experience. From people I know, they continued working in tech as contractors/freelancers, but for small fry (as big banks will be very thorough on your background (criminal/credit scoring) checks). Doing small gigs for small companies where you don't handle personal/sensitive data can give you enough time to (as the parent suggests) have this 'forgotten'. Would you consider moving to another country?

lazyasciiart 3y ago
A felony will block migration through most channels.
aghastnj 3y ago
When you say "big banks" you're actually crossing several regulatory domains. But as an example, here's the FINRA page on what they won't allow: https://www.finra.org/rules-guidance/guidance/eligibility-requirements https://www.finra.org/rules-guidance/guidance/eligibility-re... FINRA (Financial Industry Regulatory Authority) is the public face of the USA's "Securities and Exchange Commission". They write the rulebook on who gets to work in the industry (stockbrokers, investment bankers, and the like).

austin-cheney 3y ago

I have spent a good portion of my career with security clearances. If there is a background check that involves sending actual humans out to perform interviews then be absolutely up front about everything because they are going to discover it anyways. In this context being upfront saves lots of time whereas the opposite could result in additional investigations you don’t want. If it’s just some mom and pop shop then I fully agree. Just tell them enough to fully and honestly answer their questions without opening additional causes for concern.