5 ms·

There are generally 4 major cyber powers that I consider when hearing about new advanced techniques / applications / threats: USA, Russia, Israel, China (in rou

There are generally 4 major cyber powers that I consider when hearing about new advanced techniques / applications / threats: USA, Russia, Israel, China (in roughly that order). Israel is obviously complicated because historically a lot of their work has been in partnership with the USA, but that seems to be mildly less the case these days.

janice1999 3y ago
> Israel is obviously complicated They also have a large and profitable industry selling state of the art tools to authoritarian regimes/dictators to target democracy activists and journalists.
- Snow_Falls 3y ago
  But would they sell to Russia/China which is in opposition to their biggest sponsor - the USA? The answer is obviously: if they can get away with it. Personally it seems more likely to be US but that's just a gut feeling.
- tptacek 3y ago
  So does every other industrialized country.
  - SpaghettiCthulu 3y ago
    Source? I've not heard of an NSO Group equivalent in any other country.
    - tptacek 3y ago
      How much attention do you pay to the space? (I'm asking sincerely.)
      - SpaghettiCthulu 3y ago
        Perhaps not enough. I've certainly heard of shady companies, but I simply am not aware of a direct analogue to NSO Group. I am curious if you know of one!
spacephysics 3y ago
I could be very wrong, but I feel Israel’s cybersecurity tech is more advanced than Russia (could be my western programming lol)
- gjsman-1000 3y ago
  When you look at home media, every major development has been Russian. Software for cracking Blu-rays? Russia was first. Software for cracking 4K UHD Blu-rays? Russia was first. Software for cracking Nintendo Switch games (DBI)? Russia was first. The new flash-cart for the Switch, assuming it's legit? Russia. The only hacker left who can crack Denuvo video games? Russian.
  - HybridCurve 3y ago
    Necessity is the mother of all invention. This could just be related to socioeconomic factors.
    - codeflo 3y ago
      A dysfunctional criminal justice system probably doesn't hurt either.
      - SpaghettiCthulu 3y ago
        > A dysfunctional criminal justice system probably doesn't hurt either. Actually, I would argue that a system that allows DRM cracking is far more functional than the one we have in the west.
        codeflo 3y ago
        You're comment history doesn't suggest that you're a Russian troll, so my interpretation is that you're making a pointed remark that you either don't really mean or perhaps haven't fully thought through. So without meaning any offense, let's pick this apart. To be fair, I disagree with my country's cracking laws as well. We should do better here, the right to one's data is an important freedom. I support the fight for saner copyright laws. But let's also be real: There's no universe where that injustice somehow outweighs the entirety of human rights violations that go on inside Russia. Persecution of minorities, decriminalization of domestic violence, torture in prisons. Just to name a few. Western copyright laws aren't good. But there are worse fates in life than not being able to watch old blu-rays.
newsclues 3y ago
France and the UK are also world class. Anyone else?
- AtlasBarfed 3y ago
  Imo the siloing / rehacking smacks of multiple contractors being coordinated by a government agency. The contractors don't want to share 0days, so the hack boundary handoffs between contractors seems apparent to me. That would suggest US or Israeli sourcing, or maybe Saudis who are eager buyers of Israeli hacking products
- wil421 3y ago
  The Dutch have a few high profile hacks I’ve read about. Including literally watching the Russians hack the DNC.[1] [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2018/01/26/dutch-media-reveal-country-to-be-secret-u-s-ally-in-war-against-russian-hackers/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2018/01/26...

janice1999 3y ago

> Israel is obviously complicated They also have a large and profitable industry selling state of the art tools to authoritarian regimes/dictators to target democracy activists and journalists.

Snow_Falls 3y ago
But would they sell to Russia/China which is in opposition to their biggest sponsor - the USA? The answer is obviously: if they can get away with it. Personally it seems more likely to be US but that's just a gut feeling.
tptacek 3y ago
So does every other industrialized country.
- SpaghettiCthulu 3y ago
  Source? I've not heard of an NSO Group equivalent in any other country.
  - tptacek 3y ago
    How much attention do you pay to the space? (I'm asking sincerely.)
    - SpaghettiCthulu 3y ago
      Perhaps not enough. I've certainly heard of shady companies, but I simply am not aware of a direct analogue to NSO Group. I am curious if you know of one!

spacephysics 3y ago

I could be very wrong, but I feel Israel’s cybersecurity tech is more advanced than Russia (could be my western programming lol)

gjsman-1000 3y ago
When you look at home media, every major development has been Russian. Software for cracking Blu-rays? Russia was first. Software for cracking 4K UHD Blu-rays? Russia was first. Software for cracking Nintendo Switch games (DBI)? Russia was first. The new flash-cart for the Switch, assuming it's legit? Russia. The only hacker left who can crack Denuvo video games? Russian.
- HybridCurve 3y ago
  Necessity is the mother of all invention. This could just be related to socioeconomic factors.
  - codeflo 3y ago
    A dysfunctional criminal justice system probably doesn't hurt either.
    - SpaghettiCthulu 3y ago
      > A dysfunctional criminal justice system probably doesn't hurt either. Actually, I would argue that a system that allows DRM cracking is far more functional than the one we have in the west.
      - codeflo 3y ago
        You're comment history doesn't suggest that you're a Russian troll, so my interpretation is that you're making a pointed remark that you either don't really mean or perhaps haven't fully thought through. So without meaning any offense, let's pick this apart. To be fair, I disagree with my country's cracking laws as well. We should do better here, the right to one's data is an important freedom. I support the fight for saner copyright laws. But let's also be real: There's no universe where that injustice somehow outweighs the entirety of human rights violations that go on inside Russia. Persecution of minorities, decriminalization of domestic violence, torture in prisons. Just to name a few. Western copyright laws aren't good. But there are worse fates in life than not being able to watch old blu-rays.

newsclues 3y ago

France and the UK are also world class. Anyone else?

AtlasBarfed 3y ago
Imo the siloing / rehacking smacks of multiple contractors being coordinated by a government agency. The contractors don't want to share 0days, so the hack boundary handoffs between contractors seems apparent to me. That would suggest US or Israeli sourcing, or maybe Saudis who are eager buyers of Israeli hacking products
wil421 3y ago
The Dutch have a few high profile hacks I’ve read about. Including literally watching the Russians hack the DNC.[1] [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2018/01/26/dutch-media-reveal-country-to-be-secret-u-s-ally-in-war-against-russian-hackers/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2018/01/26...