3 ms·

Surprising, given the Wayland/GNOME sabotage. (I installed Ubuntu 22.04 on a Dell XPS 17 yesterday. After running apt update && apt upgrade it boots into a bla

Surprising, given the Wayland/GNOME sabotage. (I installed Ubuntu 22.04 on a Dell XPS 17 yesterday. After running apt update && apt upgrade it boots into a black screen)

doix 3y ago
I take it those laptops have an Nvidia card? I wouldn't try to use Wayland with an nvidia card. I hear it works better with AMD cards from other HN users. Personally, I don't think I'll be changing over anytime soon though, as long as X11 still compiles and works, I'll probably keep using it.
- bogwog 3y ago
  > Personally, I don't think I'll be changing over anytime soon Maybe, maybe not. There are at least two forces at work on this issue: 1. Nvidia themselves, who are collaborating with the Wayland project to improve compatibility with their driver (https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/-/merge_requests/967 https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/-/merge_requests...) 2. The new "NVK" open source Nvidia driver, which (unlike Nvidia's proprietary driver) can work perfectly on Wayland without changing Wayland (https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/-/tree/main/src/nouveau/vulkan https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/-/tree/main/src/nou...) I'm not sure if (1) will fix every Nvidia/Wayland bug that exists right now, but (2) will definitely be able to reach perfect Wayland compatibility faster without sacrificing performance like the original nouveau driver.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
tapoxi 3y ago
If you're using an Nvidia card, that's the likely culprit.
- severino 3y ago
  Shouldn't your distro know that yours is a Nvidia card, and make the necessary to avoid that you boot into a black screen after upgrading your system using the standard procedure?
  - tapoxi 3y ago
    I don't think you can fault your distro because Nvidia in general is a mess. Here's how it works: * Kernel -> Nvidia shim -> nvidia binary driver * You upgrade, you get a new kernel, the shim needs to be recompiled (ideally automatic using dkms) * This fails for some reason due to missing kernel headers, some weird compilation bug, etc. You end up with a black screen. Ideally Nvidia just open sources and upstreams their driver, like AMD and Intel have done. I know they've been making steps, but there's nothing the Linux world can really do to solve this outside of trying to make a good open source driver like nouveau. But nouveau can only be developed using reverse engineering because Nvidia refuses to provide public detailed documentation on their cards.
    - severino 3y ago
      Of course it's not the distro's fault but they can improve its robustness making that failures during the process (like in the step #3 from your comment) are handled in a way so that the entire update is rolled back. I guess this is what niche distributions like NixOS try to ensure.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

Surprising, given the Wayland/GNOME sabotage. (I installed Ubuntu 22.04 on a Dell XPS 17 yesterday. After running apt update && apt upgrade it boots into a black screen)

doix 3y ago

I take it those laptops have an Nvidia card? I wouldn't try to use Wayland with an nvidia card. I hear it works better with AMD cards from other HN users. Personally, I don't think I'll be changing over anytime soon though, as long as X11 still compiles and works, I'll probably keep using it.

bogwog 3y ago
> Personally, I don't think I'll be changing over anytime soon Maybe, maybe not. There are at least two forces at work on this issue: 1. Nvidia themselves, who are collaborating with the Wayland project to improve compatibility with their driver (https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/-/merge_requests/967 https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/-/merge_requests...) 2. The new "NVK" open source Nvidia driver, which (unlike Nvidia's proprietary driver) can work perfectly on Wayland without changing Wayland (https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/-/tree/main/src/nouveau/vulkan https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/-/tree/main/src/nou...) I'm not sure if (1) will fix every Nvidia/Wayland bug that exists right now, but (2) will definitely be able to reach perfect Wayland compatibility faster without sacrificing performance like the original nouveau driver.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]

tapoxi 3y ago

If you're using an Nvidia card, that's the likely culprit.

severino 3y ago
Shouldn't your distro know that yours is a Nvidia card, and make the necessary to avoid that you boot into a black screen after upgrading your system using the standard procedure?
- tapoxi 3y ago
  I don't think you can fault your distro because Nvidia in general is a mess. Here's how it works: * Kernel -> Nvidia shim -> nvidia binary driver * You upgrade, you get a new kernel, the shim needs to be recompiled (ideally automatic using dkms) * This fails for some reason due to missing kernel headers, some weird compilation bug, etc. You end up with a black screen. Ideally Nvidia just open sources and upstreams their driver, like AMD and Intel have done. I know they've been making steps, but there's nothing the Linux world can really do to solve this outside of trying to make a good open source driver like nouveau. But nouveau can only be developed using reverse engineering because Nvidia refuses to provide public detailed documentation on their cards.
  - severino 3y ago
    Of course it's not the distro's fault but they can improve its robustness making that failures during the process (like in the step #3 from your comment) are handled in a way so that the entire update is rolled back. I guess this is what niche distributions like NixOS try to ensure.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]