4 ms·

Although it's worth remembering the UK is still a popular place is "disappear" since it's doesn't have an overarching ID system like most Western countries, and

Although it's worth remembering the UK is still a popular place is "disappear" since it's doesn't have an overarching ID system like most Western countries, and the UK doesn't track people anywhere near as much as it's neighbours.

pjc50 3y ago
You'd have to try pretty hard to do that, because you won't be able to work, have a bank account, rent, or purchase a house. We don't have an ID system but we have a lot of ID requirements.
pjmlp 3y ago
My experience being controlled as foreigner for various kinds of reasons kind of differs.
Nextgrid 3y ago
How does the tax authority keep track of who's dodging taxes? The fact you don't have the concept of ID cards is irrelevant if the tax authority still has an incentive to keep tabs on people (which it does in order to detect tax evasion).
- tim333 3y ago
  You don't have to declare for tax purposes unless you go over certain amounts. If you do without declaring you may get away with if for a few years but they often catch people if someone gets investigated and they see bank payments going to someone undeclared. Then you get a bit of a bill for back taxes. It's quite laid back compared to some countries though. They usually only come after your assets. Very few people go to jail.
  - Nextgrid 3y ago
    This still requires them to keep tabs on people and know they exist. So even though you may not have an ID card, HMRC still knows you exist and about your payment habits to be able to tell if something fishy is going on?
    - tim333 3y ago
      I'm not totally up to date but once you are in the system they keep tabs a bit and you have a tax ID number and such like. But for people not in the system, say come in from abroad or young and not involved yet they didn't in the past. I don't know if that will change and they'll make a database of everyone with a bank account and the like. Some years ago I moved abroad for a while and then they'd kind of drop your records after three years out of the country. Now I'm not so sure.
      - Nextgrid 3y ago
        When I arrived in the UK the first thing I needed to do before being able to work is to make an appointment at some government office to get issued a national insurance number (which is like a tax ID) which every employer requires. So while people don’t carry ID cards, everyone of working age definitely has this ID unless they exclusively work undeclared, off-the-books jobs. So I’m not convinced that the lack of ID cards is some meaningful privacy protection.

pjc50 3y ago

You'd have to try pretty hard to do that, because you won't be able to work, have a bank account, rent, or purchase a house. We don't have an ID system but we have a lot of ID requirements.

pjmlp 3y ago

My experience being controlled as foreigner for various kinds of reasons kind of differs.

Nextgrid 3y ago

How does the tax authority keep track of who's dodging taxes? The fact you don't have the concept of ID cards is irrelevant if the tax authority still has an incentive to keep tabs on people (which it does in order to detect tax evasion).

tim333 3y ago
You don't have to declare for tax purposes unless you go over certain amounts. If you do without declaring you may get away with if for a few years but they often catch people if someone gets investigated and they see bank payments going to someone undeclared. Then you get a bit of a bill for back taxes. It's quite laid back compared to some countries though. They usually only come after your assets. Very few people go to jail.
- Nextgrid 3y ago
  This still requires them to keep tabs on people and know they exist. So even though you may not have an ID card, HMRC still knows you exist and about your payment habits to be able to tell if something fishy is going on?
  - tim333 3y ago
    I'm not totally up to date but once you are in the system they keep tabs a bit and you have a tax ID number and such like. But for people not in the system, say come in from abroad or young and not involved yet they didn't in the past. I don't know if that will change and they'll make a database of everyone with a bank account and the like. Some years ago I moved abroad for a while and then they'd kind of drop your records after three years out of the country. Now I'm not so sure.
    - Nextgrid 3y ago
      When I arrived in the UK the first thing I needed to do before being able to work is to make an appointment at some government office to get issued a national insurance number (which is like a tax ID) which every employer requires. So while people don’t carry ID cards, everyone of working age definitely has this ID unless they exclusively work undeclared, off-the-books jobs. So I’m not convinced that the lack of ID cards is some meaningful privacy protection.